ESPN NBA Insider Brian Windhorst and his popular podcast, Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective, are joining the Omaha Productions podcast network, the company founded by Peyton Manning and Eli Manning. The move was announced via a video message from the Manning brothers, further expanding Omaha Productions’ growing footprint in the audio space.
Windhorst is one of the most recognizable voices in NBA coverage. He has hosted The Hoop Collective for years as a staple source for league news and analysis. The podcast regularly features ESPN NBA reporters Tim Bontemps and Tim MacMahon. Together, they blend breaking news with long-form discussions. The show resonates with diehard fans and industry observers alike.
The addition of Windhorst and The Hoop Collective aligns with Omaha Productions’ strategy of partnering with established voices who bring credibility, consistency, and strong audience loyalty.
Since launching Omaha Productions in 2020, Peyton and Eli Manning have built a diverse content portfolio. Their work spans television, digital platforms, and podcasts. The growth has been highlighted by the success of Monday Night Football with Peyton and Eli. The company has also produced several original audio projects.
In the announcement video, the Manning brothers welcomed Windhorst to the network. They also playfully acknowledged his reputation. The pair joked about Windhorst being plugged into every corner of the NBA. ESPN reached a long-term, multi-platform media rights extension in 2024 with Omaha Productions, extending the existing partnership into 2034. The agreement is a content partnership between ESPN and Omaha with opportunities for collaboration across multiple platforms.
Windhorst was recently added as a full time member of ESPN’s NBA Countdown program after signing a multi-year extension with the network. Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective will continue to focus on NBA reporting, team-building trends, player movement, and the business of basketball, while benefiting from Omaha Productions’ production resources and marketing support.
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Thank you for checking out ‘The Industry According To’. This series runs each Tuesday, and features radio and record industry executives, managers, programmers, talent, artists, and professionals from all areas of the business world. For future guest consideration, please email me at keithblackboxgroup@gmail.com.
Today we hear from someone who heads one of the most influential and scrutinized brands in audio entertainment, Rich Tunkel, Managing Director of Nielsen Audio.
Rich isn’t just a measurement executive. He knows sales, audience behavior, and sees trends emerge early. He’s at the forefront of tech, trying to keep radio measurement as reliable and modern as possible.
Radio’s Health Check
Keith: Radio is a big sector for Nielsen. You see the revenue numbers, the downsizing, and now the historically low purchase prices for stations. What’s your honest assessment of the overall health of the radio industry?
Rich: I see an industry with incredible reach and continued relevance. We consistently see that broadcast radio reaches nearly 9 out of 10 adults every week. That is a massive, unduplicated audience that advertisers can’t ignore. The industry doesn’t have an audience problem, it has a perception problem among marketers. The focus must be on value proposition and modernization. The industry has to stop selling against old data perceptions and start proving its true impact.
Our job at Nielsen is to provide the most complete, modern, and trustworthy currency so radio can confidently compete for ad dollars. We’ve also developed outcomes solutions that help radio demonstrate just how effective it is. Radio is perceived to be the least effective media, when the data shows just the opposite. Radio generates the highest ROI of any media.
Keith: Given the industry’s continued revenue decline, what would you do to stimulate revenue if you were running a radio group?
Rich: I would prioritize proving return on investment (ROI) and focusing on a holistic view of the audience.
Embrace Attribution: Leverage Nielsen data with other datasets to show advertisers the direct correlation between a radio campaign and an action (like a store visit or online purchase). Radio can no longer just sell reach; it must sell results.
Highlight the In-Car Advantage: Radio is the dominant media in the car, where most listening happens. This is a massive, premium environment. We need to market that dominance aggressively. It is also important that the automotive OEM’s recognize Radio’s prominence in the vehicle and the #1 place they give Radio over all other ad-supported audio platforms in the car.
Cross-Platform View: Don’t just sell the stick; sell the full audio footprint (stream, podcast, smart speaker). Advertisers want simplicity and scale. The industry needs to deliver its full digital and broadcast audience in one cohesive narrative.
Radio makes everything better. We see that Radio improves the campaign every time we add it to any media plan. The reach goes up, the frequency improves, the efficiency increases. All of this can be achieved for FREE if a marketer simply shifts budget (as little as 10%) to Radio. We can’t say this loudly enough and repeat it often enough.
Keith: With Nielsen’s fees not mirroring radio’s revenue pacing, is Nielsen concerned about pricing itself out of Radio over the next few years?
Rich: Our focus is on delivering value. We understand the financial pressures. Our investments—like the 3-Minute Qualifier enhancement, panel modernization, and integrating new audio streams—are directly aimed at helping the industry capture more credit for the listening it already earns and, in turn, grow its revenue base. The goal is to be indispensable by providing the currency required to transact in a competitive ad market and proving that the investment in measurement pays for itself by unlocking more ad revenue.
I also think that broadcasters too often equate ratings with national and agency-driven business. While ratings are critical for that business, the insights and ability to talk to a local advertiser with intelligence and confidence about not just your station, but the entire marketplace is essential. Local advertisers want you to be a marketing expert on all of radio, television, digital, and advertising. That’s what clients who use our data and tools like the ratings and Scarborough the best are doing.
Beyond this, Nielsen is the leading marketing intelligence platform This goes far beyond traditional advertising needs. We give a view of the entire industry and where radio fits. That helps with programming and promotional strategies in addition to advertising. Our data continues to show that there is untapped value in the audio market.
The 3-Minute Rule
Keith: It’s been nearly a year since the 3-Minute Rule went into effect in PPM markets. While reported listening is expectedly up, the ad community isn’t revaluing inventory. What are your thoughts on the 3-minute rule after its first year?
Rich:The 3-Minute Qualifier (crediting a quarter-hour of listening if a panelist is exposed for at least three minutes, instead of five) was a necessary modernization of an old rule. We are proud that the industry and Nielsen worked together on it.
The Positive: It has done exactly what it was designed to do—capture more valid listening that was previously lost, which better reflects today’s consumer behavior. Broadcasters are getting credit for listening occasions that were previously excluded.
The Challenge: The ad community and agencies move deliberately. They need time to study the new trend line and become comfortable revaluing inventory. It is incumbent upon the radio industry to proactively present this expanded audience credit to the ad buyers, showing them exactly where the new listening is, and demanding that the new currency be transacted upon. This is a long-term benefit, not a flip-the-switch revenue generator.
Keith: There are several metrics in a Nielsen Audio report. Programmers focus primarily on share. Sales teams prioritize rating. If you had to single out one data point for programmers and another for sales teams, which would they be? Which two matter most today, and why?
Rich: For Programmers: Average Quarter-Hour (AQH) Persons and Time Spent Listening (TSL). The programmer’s core job is to build and maintain a strong audience base. The new environment rewards engagement. AQH Persons is the engine of the station’s core audience, and TSL is the key indicator of product quality. If TSL is up, the product is sticky, and the listener is engaged.
For Sales Teams: Cume (Reach) and Attribution Metrics. Radio’s superpower is its massive reach (Cume). Sales should lead with that massive scale to compete with digital. However, the most critical “new” data point is Attribution. Sales must pivot to showing how radio advertising drove a measurable result (foot traffic, sales, website lift). This is the language of modern advertising and the only way to prove radio’s value beyond GRPs (Gross Rating Points).
The One Meter Theory
Keith: A common phrase throughout programming circles is, “One meter can make a difference.” It’s true: a small number of meters or a household, in a city of millions, can have a big impact on the overall radio economy and revenue flow — even one or two panelists can make or break a brand’s quarter. What’s stopping faster panel growth in local markets?
Rich:Panel integrity is paramount. Nielsen maintains a panel that is both representative and compliant. Increasing the panel size dramatically for local markets is a constant effort, but simply adding more panelists is not enough and is not economically viable for broadcasters. We must ensure the new additions accurately reflect the market’s specific demographics. This requires intense, scientific sampling.
We are constantly using advanced techniques and looking at innovations like combining our panel data with non-panel “big data” sources, to provide a more granular view, which is the ultimate solution.
The Big Picture
Keith: When it comes to usage time, radio competes with everything from radio to podcasts to TikTok. What’s truly moving the needle for radio? How can the industry increase its rank in the pecking order of attention and usage?
Rich: What moves the needle is Immediacy, Localism, and Personality.
Immediacy: Real-time information, local news, and traffic that no one else can deliver as efficiently.
Localism: The connection to the community—events, local causes, and a voice that understands the market.
Personality: The relationship between the listener and the talent. This is radio’s most unique and defensible asset.
To increase its rank, the industry must aggressively integrate broadcast with digital. Radio must make its content easy to consume on every platform (smart speakers, apps, social video clips) and ensure it is all measured cohesively. Radio needs to sell itself as a holistic audio solution, not just a signal.
Immediacy
Keith: Radio sells on delayed data. Through Nielsen’s partnership with Media Monitors, Audio Overnights gives programmers the fastest directional data to date, for stations that want to pay extra. Why isn’t something like Audio Overnights a part of the Nielsen/Media Monitors basic package for Radio clients? Why is faster data treated as a premium upgrade instead of being standard, especially as radio competes with platforms that have access to more immediate data?
Rich: Audio Overnights is a sophisticated tool that offers directional insight based on the overlap between Nielsen’s panel and Media Monitors’ production. It requires a significant and unique investment in infrastructure and processing to deliver that speed and directional accuracy. To make it standard for every client would require a significant increase in the base service price for everyone, and not every station necessarily needs or uses that level of real-time directional data. Our philosophy is to keep the core currency service (the official, accredited measurement) as accessible as possible, and offer high-value, specialized tools like Overnights as a premium upgrade for those who need the competitive edge of faster data.
Misconceptions
Keith: There will always be complaints about ratings. It’s also true though that a lot of people don’t fully understand how the system works. What’s the biggest misunderstanding of Nielsen Audio and how everything works?
Rich: The biggest misunderstanding is that we are simply counting listeners. We are not. We are projecting a statistically representative panel to the entire population. People forget that the PPM is not a device for every listener; it is a passive meter worn by a scientifically sampled, demographically balanced panel.
The system is a projection: The data in the report is an estimate of the total market, based on the behavior of this carefully selected panel.
The panel is dynamic: The panel is constantly being recruited and rotated to maintain representativeness, which can cause natural quarterly fluctuations. These are not product-based changes; they are normal panel changes.
Humans structure their lives around themselves, not your program clock. We’re measuring people who have complicated lives. Their daily routines do change based on the weather, the seasons and the events in their lives. If a family member is out of town, or they run into a lot of traffic on their way to work, or they oversleep, all of these things change their media consumption. We see panelists change their listening from one survey to the next in PPM and it’s normal.
Best Practices
Keith: Since the dawn of PPM, we’ve constantly heard about “best practices” to get ratings. Many programmers believe some “best practices” actually hurt product quality and the listener experience. What’s your response to that?
Rich: I agree, and this is a critical point. The best practice is good programming. Any strategy that focuses solely on “gaming the meter”—like excessive segmentation, rapid stop-set placement, or high-frequency music rotation that irritates the listener—is fundamentally flawed. Our meters measure listening behavior, not programming intent. If a programmer focuses on creating a great, engaging, and listenable product, the meters will reflect that with higher engagement (TSL) and more quarter-hours. We also hope the 3-Minute Rule will actually give programmers more freedom to experiment and focus on the listener experience.
Quarter vs. Quarter
Keith: Programmers and executives often knee-jerk or are forced to knee-jerk if a quarter or two are down. Even if it’s clearly more a reflection of panel change than it is product-based. What advice would you give to radio leaders about reading month-to-month or quarter-to-quarter ratings?
Rich: Zoom out. Never make a major strategic decision based on a single month or quarter.
Look for Trends: Focus on the 6- or 12-month rolling average to smooth out the natural panel volatility.
Product vs. Panel: Compare your change to the overall market’s performance. If the entire market is down, it could be a panel fluctuation. If your station is down while competitors are stable, it’s time for a product review.
Use PD Advantage: Leverage the tools we provide to analyze the behavior of listeners who joined or left the panel in a given month to understand if the change is a product issue or a panel shift.
FutureCasting
Keith: Are we close to a time when the industry measures local radio side by side with digital, social, and other connected platforms in one shared client view everyone can see, use, sell, and program against?
Rich: I don’t know that we will ever have a day when radio is measured the same way social media and other media is measured. I don’t think that’s the goal. Audio is naturally more intentional than scrolling on Instagram. It drives more authenticity and connection than many other forms of media. Radio needs measurement that serves the way audiences interact with it.
However, from a planning perspective, there is a need to see how radio and Audio interact with other media and how radio can improve campaigns. Nielsen Media Impact (NMI) is a tool used by all major holding companies and many advertisers which puts radio and podcasting in the view with Television, Cable, CTV, Streaming, Digital, Mobile, etc. and it shows the unique and indisputable strength of radio.
The Uncomfortable Truth
Keith: What’s the uncomfortable truth about today’s ratings and revenue climate you wish everyone knew or would just admit?
Rich: People are running toward digital revenue so fast that they’re leaving the most profitable and impactful audiences behind. It’s OK to emphasize streaming and podcasting because it’s what your clients want, but don’t let them talk you out of pitching your radio audience! It’s bigger, it’s more powerful and you do your clients a disservice by letting them think they’re executing a full audio strategy without broadcast.
Radio has a long future ahead of itself, but there is change on the immediate horizon. There will be bright days ahead for the well-positioned operator.
Nielsen 2026 and Beyond
Keith: What would you like readers to know about what’s on the near horizon for Nielsen Audio clients?
Rich: Nielsen is making more improvements and bringing more innovation to our radio measurement than at any other point in memory. Beyond the recent modernization of our incentives, our e-screeners and our targeted sample enhancements, there is more coming regarding something clients have been looking forward to for a long time.
We are also partnering with industry organizations like the IAB and the RAB as well as directly with our clients to elevate audio and radio with advertisers and bring the audio message to the key advertiser conferences where they gather, such as the ANA, Possible, SXSW and Cannes. We’ve also established partnerships with leading service innovators and complementary measurement companies like Edison research to bring Podcasting into Nielsen tools. This elevates Audio with our advertiser clients. Anytime we can help them plan for more audio, it is better for all of our clients.
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As the holiday season continues with Christmas just around the corner, there’s a familiar buzz in New England. A feeling so reminiscent it echoes past glory—when Brady and Belichick once ruled America’s new pastime and the New England Patriots dynasty was underway. WEEI’s Greg Hill remembers the good times of six Super Bowl championships in less than two decades.
“I get accused all the time of throwing the dynasty term around too freely, but I’m all in on it,” says Hill. “We took a four-year break to re-charge, and now we’re right back to where we were… It’s awesome for sports radio in Boston.”
Hill has been a guiding voice for Bostonians for over three decades. Following a successful 28-year career in mornings at the legendary rocker WAAF, Hill transitioned to sports talk in 2019. At WEEI, Hill followed longtime sports radio talker Gerry Callahan as the morning voice waking up Boston sports fans—a fanbase known for its passion and demand for excellence.
For Hill, it was a new opportunity to connect with the Boston morning drive listener. Now, seven years into his tenure at WEEI, it’s exactly where he wants to be, doing what he has always wanted to do.
“Getting to be there when it comes to being a part of our listener’s lives. Being able to do that for a long time is something I never imagined,” says Hill. “Other than waking up early in the morning, it’s the best job there is.”
Radio was Hill’s dream from his youth. A native of the Boston area, he cracks the mic every morning on WEEI with his teammates Jermaine Wiggins and Courtney Cox. The Greg Hill Show can be described as a melting pot of information, opinion, and entertainment, with three different backgrounds presenting the content.
The goal is the same: always finding new ways to connect with Boston sports fans. Every morning, contributions from all team members are included in the execution.
“Courtney and I get in here before the show and gather what we’re thinking from a news perspective. Jermaine is an East Boston guy, and he has no filter, which is awesome,” noted Hill. “Some shows spend a lot of time discussing how someone may feel about certain topics ahead of time. We don’t do that till the microphones are on.”
The Patriot Way
A unique characteristic of The Greg Hill Show is the exclusivity it provides. While WEEI is not the New England Patriots’ flagship station, it holds exclusive rights to interviews with key franchise figures. The Greg Hill Show began in 2019, at the tail end of the Brady/Belichick era, featuring exclusive interviews with both personalities.
Hill noted that both Brady and Belichick in that final year together were “miserable,” and the interviews didn’t provide much content for the sports fan. However, this season, with new head coach Mike Vrabel, the content has a much different feel.
“Bill [Belichick], part of the allure with him was he was just kind of a ‘dink.’ Not just with us, but with everybody,” explained Hill. “With Bill, you had to work hard to ask around a question, then to get an answer that you needed to translate to see what he was really saying. With Mike Vrabel… I think this happens sometimes when you end up being away from the job you love for a while, you’re excited about being back there. He enjoys being on with us.”
He called the interview experience with Vrabel “much better” than with Belichick, though he noted Belichick is considered the greatest coach of all time. Access to both coaches holds immense value for any morning show. It allows the show to serve as an exclusive conduit for fans, as Hill experiences every week.
While many traditional radio stations would consider the exclusive interview a massive appointment tune-in, Hill noted that how content is consumed no longer matters.
“The biggest change in this business is it’s always been a content business. Finally, this industry is getting smarter about it. It doesn’t matter the platform the content is consumed on. The content is always king,” said Hill. “However it’s consumed from my perspective is irrelevant. It doesn’t matter to me as long as people find what we do.”
Redefining Success
The demand for content is at an all-time high. Boston sports radio has delivered some of the most appealing sports content for many years. On-demand content may not always count toward ratings, yet WEEI and 98.5 The Sports Hub continue to dominate Boston’s rating share. WEEI has not always ranked as high as its competition. For Hill, however, ratings are not the only metric that defines winning.
“I’m fortunate to work for a company where the people in charge have figured out that revenue is the most important thing,” said Hill. “For a long time in this business, I guess revenue was tied to a ratings point. For me, what I’m excited about is what we’re doing when we’re working with our partners… If we go year over year and grow from a revenue perspective, I’m ecstatic.”
Hill credits that focused mindset to working under Audacy Boston market manager Mike Thomas, who joined the company in 2021. Thomas, who helped launch the competition at 98.5 The Sports Hub, brought his programming background and understood the challenges of the role Hill was serving.
“It’s great to have a market manager who has a programming background. It’s rare for me, and probably the first time that’s happened in 36 years,” explained Hill. “He has a ton of input, which is good stuff from a programming philosophy and tons of ideas. He’s someone who understands, from a talent point of view, the challenges of every day including with sales… It’s refreshing to have his approach to that as well, working with talent.”
The support and connection Hill has built with Thomas have helped guide the program to new levels of success. They focus on reaching new listeners every day.
Connecting With Those in Need
Another element of Hill’s connection with Boston is through his efforts with the Greg Hill Foundation, which he founded in 2010. The mission was simple: use the megaphone and the power radio has with the community it serves to respond to the immediate needs of families touched by tragedy.
“I wanted to create a way that we could turn the mic on at 6 a.m. and if something bad happened that people were talking about, we could find a way to help immediately,” said Hill. “We live in the most generous part of the country. We have great partners who donate a lot of money, but we also get small donations that come from people who give over and over again.”
To date, the Greg Hill Foundation has raised over $31 million, helping more than ten thousand people in need in the Boston area. From wine-and-dine events to the annual Jingle All The Way 5K and everything in between, Hill’s love for radio has been supported by his teammates at WEEI.
“It’s one of the great things about this business that separates us from content being available everywhere. Radio has always been a medium that gives back to the community,” explained Hill. “Radio is uniquely able to help the community it serves. We do it, and people give immediately. It’s an amazing thing.”
For nearly four decades in Boston, Hill has aimed to connect with his community. Whether walking around town, sharing a beer at the bar, or raising money, he engages with people and supports those in need. Greg Hill has made it his mission to find connection in a content space that becomes ever more fractured.
“I am so fortunate to love what I do, and to do it for a long time. I’d never want to stop,” said Hill. “I don’t know what else I would do. I’m not qualified for anything else and would miss the opportunity to talk to people and connect. I would miss that… I’m probably not going anywhere unless they kick me out of here.”
Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. Sign up for our newsletters to stay updated and get the latest information right in your inbox.
It’s been a busy and reflective week off for this Barrett Media sports editor. A week away to unplug, recharge, and reset my mindset moving into the crescendo of the holiday season brought up thoughts of the end. The end far too many in the sports radio industry faced this year, have already faced, or will eventually face in the months and years to come.
Watching John Cena wrap up his retirement tour, filled with gaping holes in story, left many fans desiring more from what felt like a fumbled attempt. However, one thing no one could deny about the process was that Cena got to go out exactly how he wished. He crafted a year-long exit plan, maximizing revenue for the company he elevated in every city he stopped in. No matter your emotions about the final 1-2-3 in the squared circle and how it was scripted, Cena went out his way.
Which brings me to this question about the end. Over the past year, the end has often come with a goodbye. It’s a distinct change that has happened far more than it used to. But does it make the end easier to digest, not only for the consumer, but also for the talent themselves?
The goodbye show is never guaranteed. It never has been, nor should there be an expectation. I’ve unfortunately had to be the one in the room delivering the news to long-tenured talent with massive footprints in their communities. It’s never been easy telling them they are no longer needed. Often, there is no acknowledgment of the time and effort invested over decades of work and, in some cases, millions of dollars in revenue earned for the company.
The fear if a goodbye is granted? What will they say? How will listeners react? How will clients perceive the news? Should team partners question whether staying with your brand is the right move?
There’s no book or manual for it. The move is made, feelings are hurt, listeners are dismayed, clients call for more information, and teams react accordingly.
In the last year, I’ve noticed more examples of the end coming with a goodbye.
In November of last year, KNBR let go of Tom Tolbert, only to bring him back for a goodbye show. Emotions bled through the speakers as local celebrities, one after the other, joined Tolbert to share minutes of gratitude for his many years of service to the sports community in the San Francisco Bay Area.
It was a proper sendoff for the listener, client, and team as an all-too-familiar circumstance occurred again. Top talent leaving a market through no fault of their own, just the nature of the industry. We’ve seen this more in sports, news, and music radio over the past year than ever before.
Did it make it easier for the listener and the talent to digest the end that was coming?
WFAN this past week finally announced its official lineup changes as Craig Carton gets a third crack at the Big Apple via Audacy. Brandon Tierney and Sal Licata learned their news while hosting live, but didn’t address it for days after the initial reports. While they handled everything professionally, you could hear and feel the distress in their performance as their tenure at their home station was coming to an end. It wasn’t either of their first stops in sports radio, but they knew their fate ahead of the official end and still worked through it for the good of the brand.
A brand that told both talents they were no longer needed.
Did that method make it easier for the listener and the talent to digest the end that was coming?
Then there’s the consolidation still taking place as Infinity Sports Network and BetMGM Networks merge into Westwood One Sports. Not all talent has publicly spoken about their impending end. Many have, and for months they have been processing what lies ahead. Imagine hearing that your network is ending. You are told you are not part of future plans. Yet you are still required to deliver top-notch programming for more than a month. You do so knowing that after Christmas, you are no longer needed.
Some revealed their impending end early. Some have waited. Others are still waiting to inform listeners about what comes next, if anything.
Does that method make it easier for the listener and the talent to digest the end that was coming?
I thought a lot about this while watching Cena tap out in his final WWE in-ring appearance. He didn’t have to build a retirement tour, and no one was clamoring for a long-awaited return. However, WWE allowed Cena to make the call, and they were open to the idea.
Did it work out in the end? By the metrics, WWE cashed in, sold tickets, and raised brand awareness while securing new media rights agreements, with Cena’s retirement tour serving as a major draw.
Did KNBR allowing Tolbert to do a final show benefit the brand? Can you say allowing Brandon Tierney and Sal Licata a final week of shows raised the profile of WFAN? Would you say Infinity Sports Network or BetMGM Networks allowing final shows for a large percentage of their current talent roster benefits the network heading into the new year?
A goodbye show is never guaranteed. It never should be. However, what’s becoming increasingly clear is that more brands are beginning to understand transparency and trust in their talent can carry real value, often more than the short-term protection that comes from silence or sudden exits.
When a company allows a professional to finish with dignity, it sends a message far beyond the final broadcast. It tells listeners the voices they welcomed into their lives mattered. It tells advertisers the brand respects relationships, not just line items. And it tells the remaining team that loyalty, professionalism, and effort are recognized, even at the end.
Not every ending needs a curtain call, and not every situation allows for one. But cutting talent loose without context, preparation, or the chance to say goodbye rarely protects a brand the way decision-makers hope it will. In many cases, it does the opposite, creating distrust, anxiety, and damage that lingers long after the microphone goes silent.
The industry will always be cyclical. Jobs will end. Lineups will change. Networks will consolidate. That reality isn’t going away. What is changing is the growing recognition that how you handle the end matters just as much as how you build the beginning.
John Cena didn’t need a retirement tour, but WWE trusted him enough to let him have one. The result wasn’t just nostalgia. It was value created for everyone involved. More media brands are beginning to see that same equation apply to their own talent.
A goodbye may never be owed. But when it’s earned and thoughtfully handled, it can be one of the most powerful statements a brand makes about who it is, and who it chooses to be, long after the final sign-off.
Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.
What we do in radio is art. Most don’t consider it a true art form but great radio is a performance art. With art, choosing whom is “the best” gets murky. People will choose a favorite artist then declare that artist “the best”.
In sport, quantifiable scoring determines “the best”. The team that scores the most is obviously determined “the best”. Rancor will ensue all through digital platforms, contesting if the winning team or individual is truly “the best”. One look at The X posts after Fernando Mendoza won The Heisman Trophy Saturday night supports it. Was he “the best” player in 2025? He took the trophy home to Bloomington but debate on “the best” rolls on.
Taylor Swift
You don’t have to be the best to be remarkable. Stumbling through various polls on social media, we often see whom is “the best” singer by genre, era or sex. One such poll about Taylor Swift held comments about her place as “the best” female singer of all time.
Personally, Karen Carpenter, Ann Wilson and Whitney Houston clearly top Taylor as much better singers. In fact, Chappel Roan is noted as having perfect pitch and the best pop vocalist today according to Vocal Coach Tim Welch in THIS video.
Taylor Swift built her empire on marketing and connection. She isn’t hailed as the greatest vocalist of her generation. But Taylor is undeniably the most successful female artist of all time. She understands her target audience, writes songs that tell personal, relatable stories, and markets herself with authenticity. Her entire career is proof that being remarkable is about owning a point of view, steamrolling forward with writing while performing relentlessly, and making her audience feel deeply invested in her brand.
John Daly
In golf, you say the name John Daly and his picture instantly pops into your head. John Daly’s brand is remarkable. He’s far from “the best” in his field. From the day he won The 1991 PGA Championship as a ninth alternate at Indiana’s Crooked Stick Golf Course, the hard drinking and chain smoking Daly’s brand was born.
Today Daly remains competitive in most major golf championships, still smoking regularly but the beer can is replaced with a Diet Coke. His uniqueness comes from the fact that he never tried to fit golf’s traditional mold. When the sport prized restraint, polish, and predictability, Daly arrived with raw power, unapologetic personality, and a swing that looked improvised. By being himself, Daly expanded golf’s audience, eluding the titles of “the best’ and built his remarkable brand in a sport built on conformity.
Radio is littered with remarkable brands that fall by programming standards short of “the best”.
Dick Biondi
For those who need schooling, Dick Biondi introduced the Beatles at The Hollywood Bowl. He is feted in the Radio Hall of Fame with air work featured in The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Dick hosted the first nationally syndicated music show in the country. His list of “firsts” is long.
As a personal friend and his longest tenured Program Director, I said this in front of the late Dick Biondi more than a few times. His air work was far from ”the best”. Dick‘s high-energy and fast-paced style fit 1960’s radio perfectly. He brought humor, spontaneity, and a sense of fun that made listeners feel like they were part of the show rather than just hearing songs stacked back-to-back. His shows were appointment listening, blending music, bits, audience interaction, and a contagious sense of excitement.
However, Dick was not “the best” on-air talent of all time. Far from it. Dick wasn’t a Drake Boss Jock and often times was plain sloppy on-air. If Dick didn’t brand himself early in his career with magnetic audience connection, no programmer, including me, would hire him solely on his air check. Dick walked on intros, ran a lazy board and often defied programmer’s instructions. However, throughout his remarkable career all he wanted to do is connect with his listener. That’s it. That was The Dick Biondi Brand.
Remarkable
When it comes to remarkable brands that broke the mold of their predecessors, here’s three historical examples.
WCBS-FM (New York City)
WCBS-FM was a time machine with personality. Oldies outlets, including the one I programmed in the 1990’s, pared the Music Matrix to tight, repetitive playlists. Led by legendary programmer Joe McCoy, CBS-FM placed personality first and leaned-forward into storytelling along with heritage talent.
CBS-FM was the original Adult Hits station with an eclectic but wildly successful mix of Madonna, Motown and Mersey Beat. Sprinkle in The Rat Pack, New York only staples, and Hall of Fame Talent like Harry Harrison and Cousin Brucie, and it gave the brand familiarity and human connection. Remarkable.
KROQ (Los Angeles, California)
The World Famous (1980’s) KROQ broke the Alternative mold while embracing punk, new wave, and alternative music before it was commercially viable. KROQ developed a personality-driven culture around Top 40 talent, importing Kevin & Bean from Phoenix while developing a distinctly Southern California attitude.
KROQ played the hits and also broke artists. The station shaped culture and became a lifestyle brand. Kevin Weatherly’s KROQ built success developing relationships with artists first while major labels looked to KROQ for the temperature on emerging artists. The SOUND came from the atmospherics and not typical research.
WXRT (Chicago, Illinois)
Norm Winer’s 93-XRT was as free-form as its location in an earthy facility on West Belmont in Chicago. Under Winer (who joined in 1979) 93-XRT created a unique trail-blazing balance of classic rock and ongoing new artist discovery. The sound was adult without being monotone and eclectic without being chaotic.
Most credit 93-XRT with defining AAA as a format. The brand trusted their hosts on music selection, ran with a deep playlist and championed local music discovery. 93-XRT felt curated rather than programmed. Remarkable.
Closing
As we wrote in October 2024 from Yasmine Khosrowshahi: “A good personal brand helps people recognize your name. A great one helps them explain it to someone else.”
All the remarkable brands outlined above open a file in your brain, reflecting their unique characteristics. Remarkable ideas are everywhere. Executed well, tops “the best” – every time.
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What worked in 2025? What didn’t work? What are the challenges for news/talk radio for 2026? This is the time of year to review the past and anticipate the future.
Whether you are a news talk host, sports talk host, or a music station morning show host — it is time to reassess and look at how we can be even more vital in 2026. I certainly understand the pressures you are under.
What is next? It may be time to toss out the baby with the bathwater. That may be a little too extreme. Perhaps it is time to adjust the way you are playing the game. If you are essentially doing the same style of show you did five years ago, you are likely going to be obsolete. With competitive pressure from radio competitors, TV, streaming, podcasts, and other forms of distraction, we must adapt.
Most hosts are still following the Rush Limbaugh model in one way or another, which is now almost 40 years old. Rush’s innovations were monumental and turned the news talk industry upside down. His long monologues, lack of guests, and speaking directly to listeners were a completely different approach. Rush was the expert on all he discussed, and callers were carefully screened to add value to the show. It obviously worked very well.
So what is next? I believe a brilliant host will create something new. I also know radio executives, program directors, and market managers must have the patience to let this happen. Sadly, we are somewhat chained to revenue headwinds that show little understanding of how to create the next chapter. I acknowledge that money is the fuel that keeps our companies running, but our future cannot be dictated by playing defense.
Playing defense is safe. It has worked before, and it allows us to protect ourselves in hopes of surviving a little longer. I think this is a losing strategy. Innovation can drive growth in both audience and revenue. Trying something new is a risk and often leads to failure. Without failure, there is no success. Thomas Edison failed thousands of times before creating the light bulb. Whale blubber was once an effective way to power lamps, but it had limits. We nearly wiped out the whales. Forced innovation is sometimes necessary, and radio is getting very close to that moment. The whale blubber in this case is the connected car. The radio station transmitter will likely become a thing of the past. So what is next?
It is called being essential. A listener-focused presentation that cannot be copied. With millions of competitors now in the marketplace, our mission must be laser-focused on a station’s target demographic.
There is no wiggle room. If your station or show is not delivering on its mission, there is no reason for listeners to stay. People are exceptionally selfish. Our listeners live very busy lives. If we are not providing what is expected, the listeners are gone. Radio still attracts a large swath of the community each week, but listeners are not staying as long. There are simply too many options.
You may have Spotify, Amazon Music, or a radio company app where you have built your own playlist. I have 800 songs, and most of them are not frequently played on radio stations. Some were never hits, others were hits from eras not popular in nostalgia formats, or new music that has not broken through. Music stations play well-researched songs that most people want to hear, and that is smart. The point is this: if you are not hitting your station’s mission, the audience will disappear.
For years, the mantra was that the AM band was losing cume and that if news/talk radio stations simply had great FM signals, the audience would return. The facts do not support the hype. Cume remains a major challenge for the format for many reasons. If news talk stations are not providing what they promise to listeners, it is a lost opportunity.
So what is new for 2026? It is up to you. You have the microphone. Experiment with your approach. Radio is still a winner, but competitive challenges mean it is time to adapt. Always focus on the biggest issues. Listeners expect topic A. If you are discussing the latest show you binged while your community is enraged over a real issue, you are losing.
I know the concern — audiences will tire of hearing about the drive-by shooting that injured five people last night. The data shows the average listening occasion lasts about 15 minutes. If you are not addressing the biggest issue during that time, you have failed the mission.
It is like a classic rock station playing a Billy Ray Cyrus song because listeners have heard Ozzy Osbourne too often. Consistent focus on the right priorities grows cume. News talk stations have the ability to discuss news in ways other media simply cannot.
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Last week, I wrote about the relevance of radio ratings in the current state of the market. I noted that Xperi, with the DTS AutoStage product, can produce large-sample data for in-car listening.
Further, I covered a paper given recently at an audience measurement conference in Copenhagen that described cooperation between radio broadcasters and their supplier in Switzerland to develop a new system that will cost around half as much as their current system.
One thing I did not touch on was artificial intelligence (AI). AI is working its way into our business just as it is in many other industries. AI services can create spec spots in seconds, giving salespeople more ammo when meeting with clients. SonicTrek recently released a set of four AI formats.
But what about research? The term for using AI in research is “synthetic data.” In other words, the research company uses AI personalities trained on real human data to offer insights in hours instead of weeks.
One company, Toluna, is presently selling AI research services in multiple countries. Would you like your proposed ads to be tested quickly? No problem, because Toluna doesn’t have to recruit anyone. Their “synthetic AI personas” can see, hear, and react to dynamic stimuli like TV ads and online video.
Before you think, “they’re just making this up,” AI models have to learn from humans. In Toluna’s case, their AI personas, more than one million of them, are based on first-party data from 79 million people. The company claims to have “rich demographic, psychographic, lifestyle, and consumption attributes” from their data.
It’s easy to see how an AI system, whether from Toluna or a competitor, would be worth trying for a company that needs to test, in Toluna’s words, “ideas, claims, messages, flavors, or other product features at unprecedented scale and speed.” As I write this, the service is available in nine countries, including the US, with six more on the way.
For the moment, synthetic data and personas are not being used for audience measurement, at least not that I’m aware of, but it wouldn’t be hard to imagine this happening at some point in the not-too-distant future. If we can be certain of one thing, it’s that technology improves over time. Think about cell phones and how far the device has come in terms of capabilities.
With all the competition in the AI space, why couldn’t a research company, whether an incumbent or a new one started specifically for this purpose, come up with a large-scale set of synthetic AI “people” that would yield audience estimates?
Let’s play a mental game with that for a moment. We know how hard it is for Nielsen to recruit PPM panelists and diarykeepers. That’s not to fault Nielsen, as no company or even the US government can easily recruit survey respondents in 2025. Why not AI?
If we think about Nielsen for a moment, the company has data from hundreds of thousands or maybe even millions of unique respondents in recent years. The company could match their listening and viewing data to other available first- and third-party information about these people to create the synthetic personas. Privacy issues? Probably not. Audience measurement is about aggregation, not individual responses.
To some extent, this isn’t new. We’ve been modeling data since the dawn of audience measurement. TV used genres of shows to model missing data from TV diaries. Radio has ascribed days from filled-in days in a diary to missing days for over 20 years. There are all kinds of edits and models used to deal with missing data in audience measurement. And if you think about it, weighting to populations is a form of modeling. Individual meter and diary data are weighted to make the survey look like the population.
Further, AI could take some of the “crazy” out of the system. A little AM in the top three because two heavyweight meters listened all day? A country station beating the local urban formats among Black listeners? An HD2 with a seven share? My guess is that won’t happen with synthetic data.
AI companies are moving quickly, with trillions of dollars being invested in chips, data centers, and people far smarter than me who can design the systems. These systems will get better, and at some point, someone, whether Nielsen or a new competitor, will figure out that an AI system can deliver near-real-time data that makes sense.
The investment in the design will likely be expensive, but the goal of nearly eliminating the recruitment, collection, and processing of human-generated listening and viewing data is very tempting. I don’t want to suggest when, but for my money, it’s inevitable.
Will advertisers and agencies push back? I doubt it, because the numbers they have today are just approximations anyway. AI ratings will probably smooth out fluctuations, which means fewer complaints about audience delivery.
Maybe this is just a crazy dream, but who would have imagined all the technology we have available to us today? Don’t bet against it.
Let’s meet again next week.
Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.
CNN is learning, in real time, what happens when a media company feeds a political fire and then complains about the heat. A decade after propping up Donald Trump during the 2016 campaign, the network is now being pressured by the Trump White House for not featuring Stephen Miller.
That demand isn’t about access or balance. It’s about control.
The administration has spent recent days needling CNN for excluding Miller from its shows. The network’s been labeled the “Chicken News Network,” and Vice President JD Vance piled on by suggesting that if CNN wants to be “a real news network,” it needs to “feature important voices from our administration.”
That line might play well on social media. It’s also the Vice President of the United States demanding that a cable news network serve as a PR wing for the administration. It’s the same manipulation as a high school boy telling his naive girlfriend, “If you really loved me, you wouldn’t say no.” And the fact that that’s the second least disgusting thing to come from a White House-affiliated social media account in the last few days is maddening, but I digress.
This is the bind CNN put itself in years ago. In 2015 and 2016, the network treated Trump rallies like must-see television. Empty podiums got airtime. Chyrons did the heavy lifting. Trump received wall-to-wall coverage because it was good for ratings and easy television. CNN wasn’t alone, but it was a major participant. The political monster that Trump became didn’t just wander into the village. It was invited.
Now the same political force CNN helped amplify is demanding obedience. That’s the consequence of confusing access with accountability and spectacle with substance. When you help normalize a political brand built on grievance and intimidation, you shouldn’t be shocked when it turns those tactics on you.
CNN’s current predicament is a no-win situation. It can stand up to the administration and say, plainly, “I’m not going to do what you tell me to do.” That approach would be healthier for cable news and better for the country. It would also reinforce the idea that journalism doesn’t exist to launder talking points for those in power.
Or CNN can cower. It can book Stephen Miller, let him filibuster segments, clash with anchors about mundane topics, and pretend that this is what balance looks like in 2025. That choice would buy temporary peace while permanently staining what’s left of the network’s credibility. Viewers already skeptical of cable news wouldn’t suddenly return. They’d just roll their eyes and watch something else.
Does interviewing Stephen Miller add anything meaningful to CNN’s programming? Not especially. His views are well known. His style is combative by design. The exchanges would generate clips, and social media attention, sure. And they’d serve the White House’s interests far more than the audience’s.
But there’s another layer here that makes this mess even messier. CNN isn’t just a news organization right now. It’s an asset. A potential acquisition target. Names like Netflix and Paramount Skydance hover in the background, and Trump’s preference for the latter isn’t exactly subtle.
That’s where the pressure gets real. If CNN defies Trump and draws a hard line, does the likelihood of a Paramount Skydance acquisition increase? Yeah, I think so. And that appears to be very much not what people inside the building want. Corporate futures — as we saw earlier this year with the bribe settlement that Paramount paid President Trump to end his lawsuit over the 60 Minutes interview with Kamala Harris –have a way of shaping editorial courage, even when no one says the quiet part out loud.
On the flip side, doing the White House’s bidding comes with a cost. Another credibility hit. Another reason for an already dwindling audience to tune out. CNN has spent years trying to regain trust and redefine itself beyond the chaos of the Trump era. Handing programming decisions to political operatives would undo that work in a hurry.
So here we are. A hell of a conundrum.
Ultimately, the network can’t cower now. If it does, the message is clear that intimidation works. That’s a dangerous precedent, not just for CNN, but for every newsroom watching. Still, CNN would be wise to reflect on how it helped create this moment in the first place. The network didn’t invent Trump, but it certainly benefited from him. It profited and blindly promoted, laughing all the way to the bank.
But who’s laughing now? Actions have consequences. CNN is learning that lesson right now, live on air, with no commercial break long enough to make it go away.
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2025 was one for the record books for Fox News. The network saw its highest-rated non-election year ever.
In the weekday primetime window, Fox News averaged 3.2 million viewers for the duration of 2025. That surpasses even broadcast network channels like NBC, which averaged 3.1 million viewers in weekday prime.
64% of the cable news audience was held by Fox News in both the primetime and total day viewership categories. That marks the highest share for the network since it launched in 1996.
The success of the brand wasn’t limited to linear television, either. On YouTube, Fox News saw more than 4.3 billion views in 2025. That figure represents a 57% increase compared to the prior year.
“Delivering another record-breaking year, outpacing broadcast networks, and reaching new highs on YouTube is a testament to the strength of our brand and our ability to meet the audience where they are,” said Fox News CEO Suzanne Scott. “I am incredibly proud of our unrivaled team on and off camera, whose journalism, global newsgathering skills and powerful voices continue to set the standard in news and connect with Americans nationwide.”
The 12 highest-rated programs in cable news were from Fox News. The Five, Jesse Watters Primetime, Hannity, Special Report with Bret Baier, Gutfeld!, The Ingraham Angle, The Will Cain Show, Outnumbered, The Faulkner Focus, America’s Newsroom, The Story with Martha MacCallum, and America Reports all saw double-digit growth in year-over-year metrics.
While Fox was up 14% in the primetime ratings, competitors CNN (-15%) and MS NOW (-25%) went down. The two networks saw double-digit ratings decline in primetime.
The only areas where Fox News did not see double-digit growth were in the Primetime ratings with the Adults 25-54 demographic, seeing a 2% decline compared to 2024. It also saw a 1% dip in the total day ratings in the same sector.
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With the change from the Infinity Sports Network to Westwood One Sports, many of the currently established hosts won’t be making the move. Zach Gelb is now included in that list.
On Monday, Gelb revealed that The Zach Gelb Show will end on Friday afternoon, as he will not be included in the new Westwood One Sports network lineup.”
“My employment on December 28th with Audacy is coming to a close. It’s coming to an end,” said Gelb. “Conversations before the new network was announced were had with me, and also the day after the new network was announced were had with me.
“I was under the impression, and what I was told from the people that run the new network is that I was going to have a spot on the new network,” continued Gelb. “And they kept talking to me about being their guy and their choice for 12 to 3. I don’t know what happened. I still don’t know what happened, and I’m just being fully transparent with you, but I was never extended an offer to continue The Zach Gelb Show on the new network. So that’s the announcement today, is that The Zach Gelb Show is coming to an end. Our last broadcast is going to be Friday.”
Gelb continued by noting he’s proud of his tenure with the network and looks forward to what is in store for his future.
“I’m really proud of what we’ve done here,” he said. “This is a great network, and this was a great network. I don’t know what the new network will sound like. I wish them nothing but the best. They have the right to pick who they want in their lineup. And for whatever the reasons, they didn’t want me a part of it. I think it’s a mistake. Time will tell. Maybe they got it right.
“I thought I deserved a little bit more transparency and respect from the new network. But hey, they’re entitled to make the decision however way that they wanted to,” he concluded.
Zach Gelb originally joined CBS Sports Radio in 2018, hosting the network’s 2-6 AM ET timeslot. However, he left the network in 2019 to work for SiriusXM Mad Dog Sports Radio and SiriusXM NFL Radio.
In 2020, he returned to CBS Sports Radio to host the 6-10 PM ET window, moving to the 3-6 PM ET timeslot in 2023.
Westwood One Sports has yet to announce who will host the 12-3 PM ET timeslot when the network launches.
Currently, the lineup consists of:6-9 AM ET: Drake C. Toll 9 AM-12 PM ET: You Better You Bet with Nick Kostos 12-3 PM ET: TBD 3-6 PM ET: The Jim Rome Show 6-11 PM ET: Bet MGM Tonight with Brad Evans and Pat Boyle
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