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“FIT and Compatibility” Are Dead, and Country Music Radio Will Confirm It This Week

Kevin Robinson
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“FIT and Compatibility” Are Dead, and Country Music Radio Will Confirm It This Week

“FIT” is dead. “Compatibility” is being pulled 6 feet under in FIT’s wake. There’s no better petri dish than Country Music Radio to verify these deaths.

Tomorrow, The Country Radio Seminar launches in Nashville. The lobby of The Omni in Nashville is the central nervous system of C.R.S. idea exchange. Down the atrium, the Bongo Java Coffee Shop will be abuzz with new networking friends and reconnections with old comrades. You have to wonder if anyone will be discussing how fractured the country playlists have become. Dozens of titles have creeped in with zero “FIT and Compatibility”.

“FIT and Compatibility” was manufactured in the mid-90’s by researchers to convince programmers that their core listeners would likely accept core music and artists already saturated in their playlist and reject sounds that weren’t represented in their current Music Matrix. During research sessions, a research respondent would now have the additional capability to choose whether the song “FIT” their favorite station – regardless of total positive or negative overall score. As a result, many high-testing records were often tossed in the trash can when building a fresh library – post music test.

Their theory –“provide scores that measure how well each tested song aligns with the key musical preferences of your target audience, current playlist that helps your station create a more cohesive and strategically optimized music mix.”

We’ve countered for years that “FIT and Compatibility” is a “Catch-22” (from Joseph Heller’s 1961 novel of the same name). It describes a paradoxical situation where an individual is trapped by contradictory rules or conditions. “Catch-22” describes a no-win situation where the solution is blocked by the problem itself.

Example: Job experience paradox:

You need experience to get a job, but you need a job to get experience.

In the “FIT and Compatibility” “Catch 22”, listeners will almost always reject with what they are not comfortable. However, when those same listeners HEAR the song within the orbit of favorite station’s playlist, “FIT and Compatibility” softens greatly. Therefore a song will never “FIT” until it’s on the air. 

Simply play it with regularity and it will “FIT”. We’ve presented for years that listeners don’t like what they don’t hear. A short discussion of the phenomenon using The Country Charts.

Flashback back to the 2019 Country Charts – the remix of Lil Nas X’s “Old Town Road” featuring Billy Ray Cyrus in duet mode delivers. The remix of “Old Town Road” was banned from The Billboard Country Charts as it didn’t have “enough elements of modern country music” according to Billboard gatekeepers. When anointed as a ‘country’ song, it topped out at #50 after Billboard granted “Old Town Road” the ‘privilege’ of occupying their list. Quickly, the tune became a researched smash. Perhaps a harbinger of was to come?

Flash-forward to late March 2024. Beyoncé’s “Cowboy Carter” drops – going on the win The Grammy for Album of the Year AND Country Album of the Year even though most programmers help off airplay because – you know – Beyoncé. Guess it was country ‘enough’.

Track #17 on “Cowboy Carter” – “Levii’s Jeans” – featured rapper Post Malone in his first tip-toe into Country Music. Six weeks after his Beyoncé duet, Post Malone announced his next single, entitled “I Had Some Help” (featuring Morgan Wallen) – released on May 10. Country Programmers applauded. Malone earned 167 first-week adds at country radio while breaking Spotify’s single-day country streaming record with nearly 14 million streams. Suddenly non-country artists were – “FIT and Compatible”.

But wait – there’s more!

A rapper with Nigerian ancestry topped the 2024 Billboard Charts for 19 weeks, becoming the #1 Country Song of the year. Shaboozey also claimed the title of Billboard’s longest #1 title with “A Bar Song”.

Nashville-based Alternative Rapper Jelly Roll had his Country Radio breakthrough in 2022 with “Son of a Sinner” – creating strong headwinds of what was to become. Jelly’s Beautifully Broken debuted at #1 on The Billboard Top 200 album Charts in November of 2024 – with emotional storytelling about tattoos, raw lyrics, addiction and hardship.

Country Music = stories.

Clear examples of “FIT and Compatibility” roadkill outside Country Radio are plenty. Before the Kate Bush “Stranger Things” chart topper, there were dozens before her.

Lizzo into “Running Up That Hill”? Strange indeed. A 1962 chart-topper from The Contours was pushed back on the 1988 charts thanks to “Dirty Dancing”. Madonna into “Do You Love Me”? Take that – “FIT and Compatibility”

A 1990 spin around The Potter’s Wheel in “Ghost” had a 1965 Righteous Brothers hit back into the Billboard’s Top 20. Prince into “Unchained Melody”? Messy. Queen has popped into The Billboard Hot 100 nearly a 1/2 dozen times with the same song. House of Pain followed by “Bohemian Rhapsody”? It happened, shattering “FIT and Compatibility”.

Find a partial list of resurrected tunes HERE.

Chatter around Bob’s Steak House bar inside The Omni at The Country Radio Seminar bar certainly will contain discussion about new artists Remy Garrison and Ella Langley. Perhaps it should be how Country Radio scores a duet with Kendrick Lamar (having tripled streaming records on February 11th) and Blake Shelton.

“Fit and Compatibility” are indeed dead. Perhaps it never was alive.

‘The Paulie And Tony Fusco Show’ Laughing all the way to Eagles’ Super Bowl win

John Mamola
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‘The Paulie And Tony Fusco Show’ Laughing all the way to Eagles’ Super Bowl win

Every member in sports media can always agree on one thing: success on the field leads to success off it. Whether you’re in radio, television, podcasting, or print, the goal is to grab a bite of the apple when the local franchise can call themselves champions.

Earlier this month, the Philadelphia Eagles won their second NFL championship, beating the Kansas City Chiefs in Super Bowl LIX. Following the victory, the rabid fanbase of Philadelphia celebrated in the streets, loud and proud, as only one would expect a die-hard Philadelphia sports fan to do. It shouldn’t come as a shock to anyone who follows sports that some would say there’s a slight stereotype that plays into what makes a “Philly fan,” and that’s where the highly successful Philadelphia sports satire podcast The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show taps into that stereotype and plays the hits with the most success.

“The social media following and the views have really skyrocketed on us, especially as we hit playoff time in December, January, February,” said Sharief Ali, who plays ‘Tony Fusco’ on the podcast. “We had by far our best months in terms of metrics and views, doubling and almost tripling what we normally do any given month. It’s been really amazing.”

What was once a simple bit idea pitched in a pre-show morning meeting of The Herd with Colin Cowherd has now turned into a weekly podcast with a massive social following. Ali, along with co-host Andrew Samson, who play the characters ‘Tony’ and ‘Paulie Fusco’ respectively, were producers on Cowherd’s program in 2016.

“Sharief pitched an idea talking about sports talk radio in the Philly area and how it’s just full of clichés,” said Samson of the pitch nearly ten years ago. “Colin jumped on this and was like, ‘Yeah, there are so many clichés. These guys are always talking clichés. It’s ridiculous.’”

What was once an idea in a morning meeting has now turned into a successful passion project for both Samson and Ali. The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show, distributed by iHeartPodcasts and FOX Sports Radio, is a satire of sports talk radio and “hot take” media personalities hailing from the City of Brotherly Love. While the show is not built on any one specific personality from the past or present voices of the market, the building blocks of how the show is written and produced lean on the tools of the trade from both Samson and Ali’s radio beginnings.

“We both come from that producing background,” said Samson, who plays Paulie Fusco. “When we were in our jobs, the goal was to have the smartest angle on a topic, the most unique angle that made people think. In this show, we try to do the reverse. We want to have the dumbest angle that shows no thought possible—so dumb you can’t even believe somebody would say that. And then the joke is that Paulie and Tony are delivering these takes as if they think they are the smartest takes in the world.”

With the goal of getting the laugh and earning the subscribe or follow, some brash Philadelphia sports fans may not buy into the satire, considering it potentially an insult to their native tongue. What might surprise you is that fans of The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show want to be more a part of the act, not just consuming the content like a normal show or podcast.

“It’s been really amazing because our audience is all in on the joke,” Ali said of the podcast’s following. “I liken it to WWE. When you go to a show, you sort of suspend your disbelief and join in on the storylines. And our audience, over time, has started to buy in. So the audience also is in on the joke most of the time.”

Speaking of the audience, The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show currently leans on short-form video to drive views and followers. Their combined TikTok and Instagram following surpasses 100,000 followers, with every show edited and packaged for YouTube consumption outside of the audio podcast alone. As noted earlier, everyone loves a winner, and The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show netted over eight million views in the month leading up to the Super Bowl.

The show also made news recently as they were named back-to-back winners in the “Best Sports Comedy” podcast category, beating out digital competitors such as Shannon Sharpe and Chad Ochocinco’s Nightcap podcast. So what makes The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show stand out among their competition?

“We worked for several people who are very good at coming up with takes, and they’re very legitimate voices. And then there are other people who are clearly just talking for clicks and don’t know what they’re talking about. The line between those two people is very blurry, and that is what we are joking about,” explained Samson.

“We are the people who are… we try, and we’re sort of real, but we’re also sort of wrong. We’re making fun of that hot take world where anybody with a mic can say anything now.”

The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show is more than just two guys crafting, writing, and executing a podcast. They also welcome notable guests from across the sports world—only to abruptly kick them off the show as part of the humor within the joke. Notable names such as sports radio host Dan Patrick and former NFL players Chris Long, Eric Dickerson, and Drew Bledsoe have all been welcomed to the show—only to be cast off for something they said that didn’t agree with either host.

However, like any other sports radio program, there’s always that one big-name guest that seemingly remains elusive.

“The recurring joke is that we invited Nick Foles on the show every week, and that he agreed to come on, but for some reason, never did for 432 consecutive weeks,” joked Samson. “Now, we’re in kind of a bind because now that Jalen Hurts is also a Super Bowl MVP for the Eagles, we’re not sure where to go with the bit right now.”

Ali added, “We’re very fortunate that most of our wish list has actually come on the show. So, Tom Brady—that’s goal number one—and Nick Foles.”

Two former radio producers now producing their own highly successful podcast as a passion project should also serve as a model for talent who have yet to step outside their comfort zone. Both say it took a lot of effort—and still does—but the rewards now are fulfilling in many aspects.

“We edit it, we post, we are all doing the work, and we learn so much about how each platform works differently,” said Samson. “Because when we get to see how each clip performs and doesn’t perform, we learn from that. So that is my best advice. The more hands-on you can be, the more you take on yourself, the more you’re going to learn about what is working and what isn’t for your podcast. Then you make changes based on that.”

The Paulie & Tony Fusco Show drops new episodes each Thursday wherever podcasts are available.

Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.

The Todd N Tyler Empire Depends on Authenticity and Fierce Loyalty

Charese Fruge
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The Todd N Tyler Empire Depends on Authenticity and Fierce Loyalty

‘Todd N Tyler’ features Mike Tyler and Todd Brandt. The talented duo stared doing mornings together in Harrisburg, PA in 1993. A few months later they moved to KEZO/Z-92 in Omaha, NE, and have been there ever since. The show began syndication in the fall of 2006 and remains syndicated today on stations like T-95 in Wichita, The Blaze in Lincoln, NE, and a “stripped down” version of the show is heard on a one day delay in Sandpoint, ID and Mason City, IA. All stations are active rock or mainstream rock.

Big P joined the show as producer in early 2007 after interning for Todd and Tyler. Nick Allen started as a local comedian who stopped in from time to time. He was later added to the program full time in early 2020. A rotating cast of local comedians and/or friends of the show make semi-regular appearances, as well as national touring comedians that come through the local Funny Bone comedy club.

“The show is all talk, all morning,” explains Todd. “News, sports, lifestyle and pop culture issues, celebrity interviews. We talk about music from a variety of genres and eras during the show. We’re all big fans of music but we don’t actually play any music during the show.”

“Our show seems to inspire a fierce loyalty from our listeners. Many times, we’ve been told that the way we live our lives on the air, sharing so many parts of our day to day happenings, makes the listeners feel like they know us personally,” says Todd. “We’re the weird brothers/dads/drunk uncles that feel like part of their own family. With the show being podcast in full every day, many of our listeners make a point to listen to the whole show so they don’t miss anything.”

As for the show’s passion project, Todd N Tyler have a long standing relationship with their local Breakthrough T1D chapter (Type 1 Diabetes). They help raise funds for it with a few events every year.

According to Todd, there hasn’t been anything earth shattering to turn the show upside down over the years. There have however been several “evolutions” of the program throughout the years. “Changes in staff have caused changes in how things operate on the air at times,” he explains. “Other times, it’s not been so much of a deliberate evolution. There’s just been certain times where certain things have run their course, and new things take their place. Having been on the air since 1993, obviously the audience’s needs and wants have changed many times. We just try to continue to give them what they want.”

“One of the things we’re most proud of is the reputation that we’ve gained with so many famous comics that we’ve come to be friends with over the years. They always say that they love doing our show because it’s so laid back and casual,” Todd says. “They don’t have to ‘do their bits’ on the air. They’re able to just come in, hang out and join the conversation that’s going on that morning. We’re proud to have that reputation. Over the years we’ve met so many cool people when they were on their way up and have seen them become huge stars.”

Another accomplishment that the entire team and station is proud of is the induction of Todd and Tyler into the Nebraska Broadcasters Hall of Fame in 2021.

As far as challenges for the show are concerned, it’s the constant changing of the industry. “Especially right now,” insists Todd. “But not all of it is bad. Yeah, there are layoffs and reductions in force at times, but you can say that about a lot of industries. If you’re willing to embrace the change, it can open doors to things you never thought of or wouldn’t have tried before.”

“One of the biggest challenges we’ve faced over the last few years is just the constantly changing landscape of social media, and how to successfully integrate it into the on air product. Taking advantage of the good things that it can provide but also blocking out the negativity that sometimes runs wild there.”

“And yes, maybe we need more personalities in the business. More people willing to push boundaries and be their true selves on air. One thing we hear from our listeners is that the reason they like us is they can tell that we’re just being ourselves. We’re not playing characters on the air, or putting up some front. Authenticity comes through on the air. People can tell when you’re not giving it to them.”

Which brings me to my next topic. The use of or pressure to use AI in the industry. “We haven’t really used it at all. I just hope it never learns how to fully master sophomoric humor,” says Todd. “If it does, that’s when we’ll get worried!”

As for what’s ahead for Todd N Tyler in the upcoming year, “We’re just staying the course. Trying to always ‘find the funny’ of whatever story we’re discussing,” says Todd. “Continuing to bring our audience into our lives and giving them a time to laugh and escape whatever else may be weighing them down mentally.”

You can follow Todd N Tyler on Facebook, on X, and Instagram.

SNL50 Presented The Best Way To Celebrate Your Brand

Demetri Ravanos
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SNL50 Presented The Best Way To Celebrate Your Brand

Brands don’t matter is a belief I have held for years. Your call letters and positioning statement only have as much value as the people you hire and moments you create. That reality was on full display this past weekend in the two SNL50 specials that aired on NBC. 

As far as television goes, very few shows or entertainers have done as much to shape American popular culture in the last half-century as Saturday Night Live. However the celebration of the show’s 50th anniversary was not about an institution, it was about its memorable people and the moments they created.

His name was mentioned from the stage by a number of performers, but no one performer did a long, heartfelt tribute to creator Lorne Michaels. In fact, when his name was mentioned, it was more often as part of a roast than it was a loving homage. The only tribute to the iconic Studio 8H in New York City was done very much with tongue-in-cheek. 

The focus of the SNL50 specials was on stars and characters, because they are all that matter to the audience. All of the audiences’ memories are tied up in Eddie Murphy, Phil Hartman, Will Ferrell and Amy Poehler. They remember staying up late to watch Matt Foley and Stefon. They are what the brand is remembered as in the minds of every fan. No one’s greatest memory of the show is a logo or a name.

This is something the media business could stand to learn. I have seen radio stations and television networks make the same mistake time and time again. They bring out retro merch. They start airing old promos and imaging from the early days of the outlet’s existence. They put together special events that are all about the brand’s influence and accomplishments.

“No one person is bigger than the brand.” If you’re a programmer, maybe you’ve said it yourself in an attempt to reign in a talent’s ego. If you’re a talent, maybe you’ve heard it in answer to you asking for more money or resources for your show. 

It gets said a lot in our business and it is an absolute lie.

The SNL50 specials seemed to be operating with that understanding. There was no wasting time on the story of how the show came to be. It was stacking up Nick Valentine, Eddie Vedder, and the Culps on night one. For night two it was Eddie Murphy, John Mullaney, and Paul McCartney. Saturday Night Live celebrated itself and its influence by reminding its biggest fans what it does best and by showing everyone what they fell in love with in the first place.

Another brilliant move was the blending of eras. Sure, Bill Murray was there on Sunday night, but he was paired with the current Weekend Update anchors. Mike Myers came back as Linda Richman, but the character was used as part of an episode of Bronx Beat, a sketch that didn’t exist until thirteen years after Myers left the show.

There was never a moment that told any portion of the audience “this isn’t for you.” Legends, today’s a-list stars, iconic characters and the show’s current cast were woven together perfectly. Every time it seemed like one demographic was being catered to, an olive branch was extended to another.

How is a celebration worth having if it alienates your current audience? They come to you to be entertained. The last thing they want is to feel like something they love is ignoring them because another group is more important.

Brands certainly have their place in people’s lives. That is a privilege though, not a right. 

If a New Yorker is a die hard WFAN guy and wouldn’t even consider turning the dial, it’s because he connected with someone on the air there. Even if that connection was made with Mike & the Mad Dog in the 80s or 90s, he is not still tuning into WFAN if Boomer & Gio or another current show doesn’t continue to deliver. Loyalty is earned, not owed. People do and should put themselves first when they want to be entertained.

SNL50 understood the assignment of the night. If your brand succeeds by creating fans, then the best way to showcase your success is not with a dictatorial tribute extolling your success and explaining why the world is better with you in it. It’s letting the audience indulge in the things that made them fans in the first place.

The show did not do anyone behind the scenes or in the executive offices a disservice by making the night about Saturday Night Live’s biggest stars. If anything, it was the perfect way to pay tribute to what those people helped to create.

Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.

Countdown to CRS 2025: Karen West, 97.3 The Eagle

Jeff Lynn
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Countdown to CRS 2025: Karen West, 97.3 The Eagle

Karen West is Program Director of 97.3 The Eagle, WGH-FM, Norfolk/Virginia Beach.

West was recently named PD (BMM 1/10) but has been with the station for 30 years, has been MD, and now co-hosts the morning show.

West is a CRS veteran. She is known as a champion for young artists, and not surprisingly, meeting those new artists ranks high on her memory list.

“What I look forward to at CRS is always meeting the new artists and getting to know them before they blow up—getting to hear some of the new music they will offer us. CRS is great; of course, you got the ‘New Faces Show.'”

“For brand new people, it gives you a chance to meet your reps face-to-face and actually get to spend a little time with them, get to spend a little time getting to know the artist.”

West likes the idea of looking to younger people for panels with new promotion ideas.

“I’m still waiting to go to that promotional panel that’s got new ideas. I think that that’s going to be few and far between because I’ve been in radio for over 40 years. I think I’ve done them all. I’m waiting for that new blood to come in here with some great brand-new ideas we can throw out in the universe.”

West would welcome the opportunity to be on or host a panel in the future. And what does she have in mind?

“I would love to be part of a panel like that, how do you put this without offending anybody? It’s been the guy in business forever, and I would like to be part of a panel where women talk about how they’re finally getting some say. It’s exciting for me to see that corner turn and see things work.”

West would also welcome the chance to share some of the things that work well for “Eagle Mornings with Steve and Karen.”

“I would love to bring all that’s working for Steve and me to the table because it is not the phones but it’s our text line and our socials that are on fire.”

“I don’t want to talk on the phone. I’d be a lot happier if I could text and get my information in our email. Even when I have to call for doctor appointments. I’d rather talk to an automated system because I have no time.”

“That’s where it’s trending. Maybe that could be a panel to discuss where your audience is right now. They’re probably not calling you, but you should have a text line and your socials open. Always be active on both because that’s where they are.”

West is a fan of The Women’s Mentoring Breakfast, an excellent chance for successful women to coach and advise up-and-comers.

“The young women that came up are starry-eyed about the business. One of the things I had to tell them was just that it’s a long road ahead, but it’s a road that feels very, very good.” 

“A girl named Paisley (Paisley Dunn-Banks) was there the year I did it, and she was so excited. Now, I see her doing a morning show in a smaller market. It was amazing to see her passion. And she went straight into a morning show.” 

“Not many young people do that. It was great to help mentor her at that age.”

West’s favorite music memory is seeing Jelly Roll perform at the “New Faces Show.”

“My favorite showcase thus far was the one he was on. I mean, seeing everybody in the audience that had drawn the cross on their face for him.”

An unexpected appearance by Dierks Bentley at the luncheon last year also stood out.

“There was a rumor that he might be there performing “American Girl.” Then we went to that luncheon, and there he was. Valory (The Valory Music Co.) got me up close. They said you sit at our table. I never get to sit in the front. I could see the color of Dierks Bentley’s eyes. That was freaking fabulous.”

Any embarrassment of once walking into the wrong record label hang was quickly forgotten when West unexpectedly met an A-lister.

“There was one year I was face to face with Darius Rucker. I was in the wrong freaking hang. There was one with Joe Nichols, Ben Gallaher, and Nate Barnes, and they were around the same area.” 

And then there was the Midwest hang, which had all the big people, Darius Rucker and Vince Gill. Well, I walked into there thinking that was the one we were going to. I didn’t know that there was another one right next door.”

“It’s packed, and I can’t move, and I think I might be in the wrong hang. The guy in front of me turned around and looked at me, and we were nose to nose. I’m like, oh my God, it’s Darius Rucker. Do you know what? The embarrassment was worth it.”

What advice does West have for first-time attendees?

“You do get pulled into all kinds of directions. I would tell people to be patient, not overexert themselves, and to plan what to go to on the day of, not the day before.”

“Don’t try to do everything all at once because that was my mistake the first year I went. I was exhausted and didn’t get to do some of the fun stuff. But then again, you don’t want to do all the fun stuff either because you’ll be too hung over the next day. You cannot do all the panels. There are so many of them.”

Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.

Aircheck: Jeff Davis, The Big 89 WLS Chicago 1979

Jeff Lynn
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Aircheck: Jeff Davis, The Big 89 WLS Chicago 1979

So many people, myself included, will say they grew up listening to The Big 89, WLS, Chicago.

The station ruled not only Chicago but a large chunk of the Midwest. The tightly programmed Top 40 was the career inspiration for many who aspired to sound like the incredible talent lineup.

Growing up outside Chicago but within the nighttime listening pattern of the AM blowtorch, I remember being in the basement recording the station not only to pirate the songs but to study the jock’s techniques and how the station was programmed.

It was a career highlight when I later got to work for John Gehron, the WLS Program Director in the days I was studying the station. I’m happy to say I was able to continue to learn from John, this time in person and face-to-face.

Jeff Davis rocked the airwaves in July 1979. Davis is now in Los Angeles, where he has been working as a voice actor since 1992 at Jeff Davis Productions.

The audio quality of the aircheck is not great, but it’s fun to hear the jingles again and listen to Davis flawlessly execute the format. Also, notice the reverb on the mic.

Here is Jeff Davis in July 1979 on Music Radio WLS Chicago.

Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.

1130 WISN Host Dan O’Donnell is the Next Generation of News/Talk Talent in Milwaukee

Garrett Searight
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1130 WISN Host Dan O’Donnell is the Next Generation of News/Talk Talent in Milwaukee

Late last year, 1130 WISN announced it was tabbing Dan O’Donnell to step into the shoes vacated by longtime host Mark Belling in afternoons at the iHeartMedia Milwaukee news/talk station.

The appointment of Dan O’Donnell to afternoons marks a new path for WISN. Belling had been hosting at the station since his replacement was eight years old. This marks a shift from the Baby Boomer generation in afternoon drive to the Gen X and millennial generation more in line with the key 25-54 demographic.

“We’re kind of seeing that sort of transition, I think, for the next generation,” O’Donnell noted of a string of retirement and changes in the Milwaukee media landscape in recent years. “We had a bunch of legends in the past couple of years call it a career … All those guys and gals are retiring, and now I’m part of this next generation where it’s like the millennials, older millennials.

“I’m the oldest millennial — I was born in 1981 — so I’m right on the cusp of Gen X and millennial. I think we’re technically called Xennials, but we’re kind of taking over and sort of filling that gap. So it’s a unique challenge in Milwaukee because everybody has been such a part of people’s lives for so long.”

When asked what the Gen X or millennial news/talk radio sound meant to O’Donnell, he made a logical comparison.

“What I try to do is much less monologuing or giving my opinions. I mean, it is an opinion-based show, obviously, but what I try to do is provide deeper dives into the data and provide the facts. I was, in another lifetime, trained as a lawyer. And I went to law school thinking I was going to be an attorney. I was like, ‘I’ll do broadcasting until I get fired.’ Just assuming I would get fired like everybody does. Well, I guess I didn’t get fired,” he said with a laugh. “But I try to approach my show like an attorney. I’m sort of building a case for whatever it is that I’m trying to argue for and just provide the best, most logical argument that I can find.”

Mark Belling was an institution at 1130 WISN. Not only was he ingrained in the fabric of the iHeartMedia Milwaukee news/talk station, he was a staple in the Milwaukee community. And O’Donnell admitted he’d be lying if he said he wasn’t intimidated by taking over the timeslot.

“Absolutely. There has to be, right? You think you’re never going to measure up,” he shared. “What’s the old saying? You never want to be the guy that follows the legend. You want to be the guy who follows the guy who followed the legend. He’s way better, by comparison. But iHeart here in Milwaukee really understood that. So getting me on when Mark was taking time off really helped. And I’ve been doing a show on WISN for almost a decade … But yeah, just in terms of, ‘Oh my gosh, am I going to be accepted by people who have made Mark Belling a part of their day, a part of their routine?’

“My good friend, Jeff Wagner, who retired as a longtime host at WTMJ in Milwaukee, had quite possibly the greatest quote I’ve ever heard, and it was ‘People may recognize you from TV, but they know you from radio.’ And it’s true because you give a little piece of your soul … People kind of get to know you, and when they’ve known somebody for 35 years, it is difficult to be the new guy.

“But what’s really helped is that I’m really, in many respects, not this new guy, just a middle-aged guy who they’ve heard on a part-time basis for the past few years, and now we are full-time,” he concluded.

Dan O’Donnell had previously hosted mid-mornings at the station, and filled in for Belling during his more lengthy sabbaticals in past years. But on January 2nd, O’Donnell took over the afternoon drive role and shared that it couldn’t have gotten off to a better start.

“It’s been awesome, and it’s been a lot of fun,” said O’Donnell. “I feel like I have more time to research topics, to reach out to sources, to do investigative reporting, this stuff that I like to do that is just very difficult when your show starts at 9 AM. And I get a million tips at exactly like 8:30 AM and then I’m like, ‘Ok, I’ve got 20 minutes here.’ So it’s been great.”

He added that having the familiarity with not only the station and market, but Belling’s existing audience was a big help in assimilating him into the daypart.

“It was incredibly,” he shared. “I couldn’t imagine coming in cold from another market, especially Milwaukee. Milwaukee is very unique in that it’s not like a Phoenix or a Miami where people are coming there because of the weather and the excitement and all of that.

“This is obviously not a diss at Milwaukee, that’s my home. That’s the only place I want to be. I love it, but it’s a place where people spent their entire lives. We are born here. We start here. And if we come here, we have a tendency to stay here … The people are awesome. But also, I believe it was Belling himself who said it takes you 10 years before anybody in this town even knows who you are. There’s just such a summit with radio hosts and our TV news anchors stay here for 30 years.”

Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.

How Much Artificial Intelligence in Broadcasting is Too Fast and Too Soon?

Dr. Ed Cohen
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How Much Artificial Intelligence in Broadcasting is Too Fast and Too Soon?

We’re constantly hearing about artificial intelligence (AI), whether it’s wishing that we had invested some money in NVIDIA stock a couple of years ago before it took off or wondering about Elon Musk’s assertion that the government will need to establish a basic income for everyone because there won’t be enough jobs when AI takes over. This may be true someday, but as you’ll see, the data says not yet.

Last summer, I took an Engineering Management class at Western Kentucky University called “Technology and Society”. The instructor assured me that the class was more social science than engineering because, to put it bluntly, I don’t know anything about engineering. Even though I audit classes at WKU — meaning I don’t receive a grade or credit (with three degrees, I don’t need another one) — I do the work. 

The final presentation had to cover one of seven areas, six of which I didn’t know anything about and couldn’t get up to speed in a couple of weeks. Oh, did I mention this was a five-week class, condensed down from 15 weeks? The one choice left was artificial intelligence, so with the help of some friends, I learned enough about AI in broadcast radio to put a reasonable presentation together. Fortunately, the instructor knew very little about the radio business, so the final evaluation was decent.

As the radio business has atrophied over recent years, we hear about the potential for AI to take over, for better or worse. Our industry is not alone and the recent revelation about the new Deep Seek LLM (large language model) supposedly designed for a tiny fraction of what other companies are investing in the technology has shaken the artificial intelligence world.

But maybe we’re getting ahead of ourselves. The Census Bureau’s Business Trends and Outlook Survey (BTOS) has been asking about the use of AI in business for the last couple of years and the results are interesting.

BTOS (each time I see this acronym, I think of Bachman Turner Overdrive) says that as of the January 30, 2025 update, only 5% of businesses are using AI to produce goods or services. 84% are not using AI and 11% don’t know if they’re using AI or not! Looking ahead, only 6.5% plan to use AI in the next six months.

Because all sorts of businesses are included, let’s check the results for larger businesses (250+ employees), assuming bigger companies would be more likely to be first movers. The current use percentage goes up…all the way to 7.2% with future use at 11%. 

How about the effect on employment? Won’t AI cause massive layoffs as the technology replaces humans? According to the Census, not yet. Of the companies using AI, 2.8% said they had increased employment while 2.6% said employment was reduced due to AI, in other words, a wash.

BTOS does not break out media but does have a category entitled “Arts and Entertainment”. In this sector, 5% of businesses are using AI now and 6.1% plan to in the next six months. However, there was a greater, albeit very small, effect on employment. Not a single business said they had hired more people due to the introduction of AI, but 2.2% said they cut headcount. 

Suggesting that AI will be a bust in the future seems ludicrous, but if we are to believe the Census — one of the best survey operations in the world — it’s not a big deal yet. And while BTOS does not break out a “media” category and definitely not a “radio” category, we can surmise that adoption is happening, albeit slowly. 

My presentation last summer cited uses of AI for radio such as spec spots and AI voices for emergencies when no local talent is available. Yes, I covered “AI Ashley” and the new services from Futuri and RadioContentPro. Anyone betting against AI in our business will probably be wrong in the long run.

Like any other technology, AI will get here but likely later rather than sooner. There is a lot of promise in artificial intelligence analyzing large data sets, doing drudge work (think reviewing legal documents that run on for thousands of pages) and more. A recent Fred Jacobs blog talked about “synthetic data” using AI and the problems that result from that (and thanks for the shout-out about The Bedroom Project and Goin’ Mobile…truly great research projects that I was a small part of along the way). 

If you’d like to review the Census data, it’s here. Navigating the website is easy and besides, it’s your tax dollars at work! 

Let’s meet again next week.

Zach Kram Joining ESPN as National NBA Writer

BSM Staff
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Zach Kram Joining ESPN as National NBA Writer

ESPN has signed Zach Kram to join the company as a national NBA writer, further bolstering its coverage of the NBA. Kram had announced last week that he was concluding his time with The Ringer after nine years with the outlet. Under his new role, he will be joining a roster that includes industry veterans such as Ramona Shelburne, Shams Charania and Brian Windhorst as the network prepares to commence a new 11-year media rights deal with the league, reportedly worth $2.62 billion per season.

In a series of posts on X, Kram described that he had landed his dream job out of college with The Ringer and affirmed how much he loves and values the outlet. Furthermore, he divulged that he started working as an intern for the digital media brand one week before the website launched and conveyed his gratitude for being able to grow alongside it. Kram has written several articles for the outlet over the years discussing topics such as basketball, baseball and pop culture.

“I’m positively thrilled to embark on a new journey with the wonderful NBA team at ESPN,” Kram shared on social media just after the announcement on Monday afternoon.

Kram studied psychology, history and creative writing while matriculating at Washington University in St. Louis while also participating in the Student Life newspaper publication. Throughout his time in college, he held various leadership positions with the outlet, including copy chief, senior sports editor and longform editor. Ahead of his graduation within the Class of 2016, he was an intern for The Daily Record and later became an editorial assistant with The Ringer. Kram had been a staff writer for the brand for over six years and also participated on a variety of podcasts through the Spotify-owned platform.

Earlier in the season, ESPN signed a variety of its NBA talent to contract extensions, some of whom include Bobby Marks, Danny Green, Angel Gray and Tim Bontemps. The network recently averaged 2.01 million viewers for its broadcast of Luka Dončić making his debut as a member of the Los Angeles Lakers. ESPN will present the NBA Finals on ABC at the conclusion of the season for the 22nd consecutive year.

Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.

Chris Crowley Exits iHeartmedia Charlotte and Raleigh

BMM Staff
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Chris Crowley Exits iHeartmedia Charlotte and Raleigh

Chris Crowley has left the building. In a Linkedin post, the veteran radio executive shared that his time with iHeartmedia has come to a close. Crowley was alerted last week that his time with the company had come to an end. It marked the end of 34 years in the industry.

Recently, Crowley served as PD of 106.5 The End and 99.7 The Fox in Charlotte. He also oversaw 100.7 WRDU and ALT 95.3 in Raleigh.

Though he says he’s not shutting the door on returning to radio, Crowley acknowledged that his days of packing up and moving are done. If it means the end has arrived, he’s content with what he’s accomplished in over three decades in the business.

Crowley highlighted his time working with the Woody & Wilcox Show. He also singled out Lisa Worden, Garner Goin, and Steve Geoffries for providing valuable insight, guidance, and a willingness to listen. Chris Rozak was also recognized for being the epitome of a team player, and an outstanding colleague.

Before landing in the Queen City, Crowley served as Townsquare Media’s Director of Content in Buffalo, NY. Prior stops during his career have included 92.3 KGON in Portland, 96.5 WCMF and 95.7 The Fan in Rochester, 94.5 The Arrow in Fort Myers, and Alternative 103.7, Star 102.3 and 95.3 The Score in Eugene. Crowley also spent time working for Jacobs Media.

Those interested in reaching out to lend support or to explore future opportunities with Chris can reach him by email here.

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