The term “Going into the lion’s den” has been a popular one with news/talk radio and cable news hosts when speaking about one side of the political aisle going into “hostile” territory for an interview or discussion.
For instance, Donald Trump “went into the lion’s den”, in the eyes of conservative commentators, when he did a town hall with CNN’s Kaitlan Collins. Or when he did a Presidential Debate with CNN’s Jake Tapper and Dana Bash moderating. Or when he did a Presidential Debate with ABC’s David Muir and Linsey Davis moderating.
And on the other side, Kamala Harris “went into the lion’s den” when she did a sit-down interview with Fox News’ Bret Baier.
Less frequently, it seems, are media members crossing those lines. You rarely hear an MSNBC or CNN host on a conservative radio station, just like you rarely see a conservative radio host on a cable news network that does align with their beliefs.
Plenty of media industry professionals will tell you that both political sides need to do a better job of reaching out across the aisle to make that happen. So, we asked some on-air talents just how they would accomplish that.
The first question was directed to Buck Sexton of The Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Show from Premiere Networks. Last year, Sexton appeared on Real Time with Bill Maher as the token conservative panelist. After the appearance, he shared his opinion that — like many — it should happen more frequently. He said he enjoyed the experience, noting it was his third time overall doing the show.
“This was told me by Bill’s staff, and by Bill himself: (other conservative guests) get into the room of people who don’t agree with them, and they want to try to play to the home crowd a little bit,” said Sexton. “I go in there, and if the people in that audience aren’t getting ready to throw tomatoes at me, I haven’t done my job on that show. And I know that, and that’s great.
“I’m willing to go in there and take the swings and arrows, because I want them to hear my version of conservatism and hear it expressed from somebody like me who lives it, who believes it, who is all about it. It’s absolutely fun to go into the lion’s den.”
Another news/talk radio host, who wished to remain unidentified in order to speak more freely on the subject, disagreed with Sexton’s sentiments. They do not enjoy the experience of wading into the waters the other side swims in.
“It has just never been worth it to me, because the conservative hosts don’t listen and aren’t interested in hearing the other side. They just want to argue,” the liberal media member said. “Sparring with someone from our side isn’t about learning for them; it’s about playing a part and looking correct to their audience.”
Sexton added a qualifier, stating that he isn’t looking to go on any and every show offering to host him.
“It’s got to be worthwhile, because otherwise you feel like you’re getting harangued for no reason,” said Sexton. “It’s not worth going on a show that has 50 people that are downloading it to have someone call you a Trumper, a fascist, or something crazy.”
He continued by noting that Bill Maher’s audience included millions who would be exposed to his “conservative ideas” that “grated additional exposure” to he and Travis’ Premiere Networks program. “If there are other programs like that, I’d be happy to go on with them,” he added, “but there really are very few these days in the marketplace.”
When asked how liberal media and conservative media can bridge the gap to allow for more open conversations, the liberal radio host said the attitude of the political right needs to change before anything will get better between the two sides.
“Conservatives are smug. That is a generalization but one that is true,” they argued. “I don’t have any interest in bringing them on my show because I don’t like the attitude, I don’t like the stances, and I don’t like the conversations that come up. Because more often than not, it turns into mudslinging. I’m not interested in mudslinging. They are. When that attitude ends, I’d think about it.”
The liberal radio host added that they felt as if they would never be welcomed to appear on a network like Fox News or Newsmax because the concern would be they would “embarrass” the host in the conversation, leading to a loss in credibility with viewers.
Another problem in bridging that gap is what medium works best to start to mend the fences. Buck Sexton told Barrett Media that while he’s interested in having more of those conversations, he believes his radio show isn’t the perfect outlet to do so.
“It’s tough in the radio format, I think, because without physical presence and without the video visual, cross talk is just the death of good radio. So if you’re going to have people who are going to disagree, you have to trust that there will be that respect for space and time. I’ve seen that work very rarely,” he argued. “Radio, I think, is a tough place. TV lends itself a little bit more to those real debates, to those real exchanges between people who strongly disagree. Not who see variations of aside on the same issue, but I mean, are fired up and passionate about their cause.
“I’m not sure that talk radio is ever going to be the place for disagreement. I think expansive ideas? Yes. Conversations from different areas? Sure. But debate turns into shouting on radio and crosstalking.”
Sexton concluded by stating that he’s more than willing to join any MSNBC primetime program to debate the issues. In fact, he believes it is foundational to the medium.
“I do think in the general media marketplace there should be a lot more of a willingness for people to engage with the other side. I mean, I think a lot of folks owe it to their audience. If they would have me on MSNBC tomorrow to have a real debate segment with one of their prime-time hosts, I would do it. I would do it because that’s worth my time … But they’re unwilling to do it.
“I would love to see more debate, and I think that the foundation of the format of political commentary, you go back to William F. Buckley and Gore Vidal. It’s supposed to be the exchange of ideas, much more so than I think it’s turned into, which is a lot of silos and preaching to the choir.”
While some view the issue as unsolvable, others are attempting to bridge the gap. In recent weeks, Gov. Gavin Newsom (D-CA) has launched a podcast in conjunction with iHeartMedia that has seem him sit down with conservative radio hosts Charlie Kirk and Michael Savage for wide-ranging conversations.
Additionally, NewsNation host Chris Cuomo recently spent more than two hours in discussion with conservative media titan Tucker Carlson discussing a variety of topics.
But, the feeling I got from both sides of the media ecosystem was similar to that of a junior high dance. The other side is waiting for the other side to make the first move and signal their interest. And if that’s the case, this issue might not be solved anytime soon.
Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. To stay updated, sign up for our newsletters and get the latest information delivered straight to your inbox.
Garrett Searight is Barrett Media’s News Editor, which includes writing bi-weekly industry features and a weekly column. He has previously served as Program Director and Afternoon Co-Host on 93.1 The Fan in Lima, OH, and is the radio play-by-play voice of Northern Michigan University hockey. Reach out to him at Garrett@BarrettMedia.com.
