There’s an old saying in the media business that you haven’t worked in the industry until you’ve been fired.
The first time that line was uttered to me I thought it was ridiculous. I was naive and believed that if you showed up, worked hard, delivered results, and treated your co-workers well, that would be enough to keep you employed.
Then I learned the hard way why it’s called the radio “business“.
Early in my career, I was working for a radio station in Poughkeepsie, NY. The morning show I was producing and providing news reports for wasn’t producing the numbers that upper management were looking for. After making numerous changes to try and elevate the ratings, our General Manager felt a change was necessary, so he cut ties with my crew, and hired a new morning show.
I had a good relationship with the boss so I figured I’d earn the benefit of the doubt to stick around. I was called into his upstairs office and sat down for an important conversation. Little did I realize entering his room that day that it would be the last time I did so.
He was very direct, and honest and told me that because the morning crew I had worked with did not deliver large enough numbers to command the business that the company needed to succeed, he had to bring in new talent to fix the problem. The challenge was that their addition would cost the company more, and increasing the budget was not an option, which meant having to trim salary in other areas.
I was then told that the only way to offset the added talent increases would be to let me go because my salary was too high. I would be replaced by someone with less experience, who’d make less, and that person would approach the situation with a fresh perspective, and great enthusiasm, which is something I’d not have been able to provide if faced with a major pay cut.
I sat there befuddled, trying to comprehend what was happening, and realized that a decision had been made, and it was now up to me to decide how I would let it define me.
I looked my boss in the eyes, shook his hand, thanked him for the opportunity, wished him the best with the new show, and promised him that he had not heard the last from me. He thanked me for my service, and told me he had confidence I would land on my feet and go on to do even bigger things in the future, and he hoped I’d remember the place where I started once I did.
As I packed up my office and left the building, I couldn’t understand why he’d praise me, and talk about my future being bright. All I could mutter to myself was “If you think I’m destined for bigger things, and recognize I do great work, then why am I heading home right now“?
Once I got into my house, and had a few days to digest what had changed in my professional life, I began to put the pieces together, and figure out where I wanted to take my career. I then started pursuing opportunities that I felt aligned with my goals, and I contemplated relocating for the first time in my career.
It took 2 months to gain employment in another market two hours away, and while that stint was rather brief, it became an important stop gap. The time spent there (Albany, NY) allowed me to detach myself from my previous situation, get my mind right, gain my confidence back, and put my focus into doing great work that would put me on the map and help me make a difference on a larger level.
As luck would have it, less than 6 months after moving to Albany, I was hired by ESPN Radio in Bristol, CT, and everything that I had gone through during the previous year became learning material and a big part of my maturation as a professional.
I remember driving to Bristol prior to my first day of work, and having some time to reflect on everything I had endured during the early part of my career. One of the most memorable and important parts of that journey was being fired. Had I not gone through that difficult period, I’d not have landed in the best situation of my career. Instead I would have remained where I was, doing good work, but not relentlessly pursuing my dreams, and making bigger contributions.
I also was able to step back and appreciate how I was terminated. That may sound crazy, but there is a certain way of cutting ties with someone that determines how they remember an individual and their experiences with a particular company.
What I valued from my discussion when I was let go, was that there was no promise of future possibilities, no smoke blown up my ass before parting ways, and there was no ridicule or sign of disrespect.
I was dealt with man to man, in a respectful but firm way, and that not only helped me gain more respect for my former boss, but it made it easy for me to want to keep open a line of communication with him. I’ve tried to remember that approach and use it when I’ve had to be in the same situation.
Terminating someone is never easy, especially when you form a working relationship with them and respect their work. Although I’ve handled some difficult situations well, I’ve also gone through experiences that I wish I managed differently. I’m proud of the fact that I haven’t mastered the way to let people go, because it’s not an area of the profession that I enjoy or seek to become an expert in.
Unless you’ve been in position to cut ties with an individual, it’s hard to understand what it feels like. People don’t see how it affects you the night before or the days/weeks leading up to it. You may want to be yourself around the office but that’s a lot easier said than done.
Contrary to what some may think, bosses wrestle with the conflict of having to do what’s necessary for business, versus thinking about how it will impact the individual’s future and their family. Most employees forget that the person delivering the message, usually isn’t acting alone in the decision process. They just happen to be the one saddled with the responsibility.
When a boss is charged with being the bearer of bad news, they’re often given instruction of how the company wants something handled. While it’s certainly smart to abide by your employer’s wishes, there are times where you have to step back, and say “screw it, this doesn’t feel right” and get the message across in your own way.
From the receiving end, when you’re hit with news that’s going to change your professional future, it’s impossible to see how it can be a blessing in disguise. Sometimes when we work somewhere, we get comfortable and stop thinking about other possibilities, and it can almost feel like we’re cheating on our employer by even considering other options.
What we lose sight of during those times is that tomorrow is not promised, and the years of service you’ve previously given to a company, don’t guarantee the next few.
As the events of the past two days at ESPN have unfolded, I can’t help but think back on what I went through and offer it as a positive reminder to everyone who is preparing for the next chapter in their careers.
The relationships you’ve created will remain with you, the impact you’ve had on others and the results you’ve produced can not be taken away, and the talents you possess will help guide you to a future opportunity that will make sense for you personally and professionally.
I know it can be difficult to think ahead when you’re focused on today, but if you have talent, confidence, passion, a strong work ethic, a positive attitude, and faith in yourself and your abilities, good things will happen.
If there’s one thing I know for sure, and this has been echoed by numerous people inside the media industry, there is life after ESPN.
Whether it’s been Rich Eisen, Colin Cowherd, Craig Kilborn, Bill Simmons, Dan Patrick, Bruce Gilbert, and Scott Masteller, or Charlie Steiner, John Seibel, Larry Beil, Rob Dibble, Michael Kim, Darren Smith, and Scott Shapiro, there are plenty of opportunities out there.
Your career isn’t over when you leave the four letter network. In many cases it’s just beginning.
Don’t get me wrong, I loved my time at ESPN, and I’m sure many of the people who are experiencing these layoffs feel the same way. It’s a great operation, with a lot of great people, and no company has invested more in sports programming during my lifetime than ESPN. The work that gets done in front and behind the camera and microphone is second to none, and when operating from a position of strength, it can be a very special place.
However, we’re seeing a major shift in the way sports fans consume content, and those changes are making it harder for companies to operate the way they’re used to. We can all sit here and assess blame for why the company has lost viewers and money, but providing solutions to the issues is what will determine if the company rebounds and has future opportunities available to pursue.
Is there some greed involved in this situation? Yes. Have the costs for rights deals for LIVE sporting events gotten out of hand? Absolutely. But expecting a business to not want to generate the largest profit possible, and sports leagues to give their partners a discount because it might impact their personnel head count is unrealistic. It’s also beyond your control and not worth investing your personal energies in.
What you can decide though is how you will learn from the experience, and rebound from it. 10 months ago I chose to leave a great position in San Francisco with no assurances that I’d land on my feet. By taking that risk, I now have my son living with me, my family close by, and I’ve started my own company and am enjoying every minute of running it.
There are many other great stories too of people who have gone on to make a giant impact in sports media after they had been written off at ESPN or another employer. You could be the next, but it starts by building off of your last experience, not dwelling on the past.
If we’ve learned anything over the years from watching sports, movies, documentaries and sitcoms, America loves a good comeback story. Now it’s up to you to create it. The biggest challenge of your career starts now.
When you think of the biggest names in sports radio, Colin Cowherd, Dan Patrick, Mike and Mike, Jim Rome, and Mike Francesa are names that come to mind. There’s a good reason for that, they’ve all been successful, and have performed on brands that are well known to listeners and industry professionals.
While many of these personalities are outstanding, and have received their due for the great work they’ve produced during the course of their careers, there are many others who fly under the radar. Identifying great talent on familiar brands isn’t exactly rocket science, but discovering authentic, unique and entertaining personalities across the country, in unfamiliar territory can be quite the challenge.
For a programmer, the job is similar to that of a professional scout. Anyone can recognize LeBron James in high school and determine that he’ll make an impact on the next level. If you don’t, you should probably stop scouting. But not every scout travels to Baxter Springs, Kansas and discovers Mickey Mantle while initially looking at one of his teammates.
I thought it’d be fun to to shine the light on some deserving personalities who I’ve had a chance to listen to and are worthy of some praise. Some of these hosts are well established in their existing markets, but not necessarily familiar beyond their local regions.
To make sure we’re on the same page, let me state that this is not a Top 15 list. It’s a piece that offers insight into the styles and attributes of fifteen different radio hosts across the country.
Also, if a personality I chose to highlight is involved in a program that includes one or multiple partners, this doesn’t mean that the others on the show aren’t good or don’t play a critical role. This is a subjective analysis based on my own personal tastes, and the objective is to make them and their work more familiar to anyone who enjoys listening to sports radio.
I hope you enjoy the column, and if you follow me on Twitter and wouldn’t mind retweeting it, I’d greatly appreciate it.
Cory “Sludge” Cove – KFAN Minneapolis – Few brands have delivered better than KFAN in Minneapolis. Paul Allen, Dan Barreiro and The Common Man receive most of the credit for it, however discounting Cory and the morning show’s contributions would be a big mistake. Afterall, the program just hit #1 in the market last week!
“Sludge” as he’s affectionately known to Minneapolis listeners, has a great sound, and is a big part of the popular morning show “The Power Trip“. For listeners who prefer a heavy sports focus, and deep level of discussion and analysis, this show won’t likely meet your expectations. In my opinion, it’s a program that wanders through the desert without a compass, and embraces every part of the journey.
The ingredients that make it special, are a heavy dose of guy-talk, laughter, unscripted conversations, and a little bit of sports. The show skews younger, incorporates a lot of funny audio clips, and offers a similar production value to what you’ll hear on top performing FM music morning shows.
Case in point, last week during the span of one hour, the show discussed the Minnesota Wild’s home opener, Madonna and Lady Gaga, Fantasy Football, the new Steve Jobs movie, the upcoming Vikings game, and the different styles of Republicans and Democrats.
You may read that last paragraph and ask “where is this show going“, and if you’re a person who’s used to listening to heavily formatted talk shows, this one may take some time to warm up to. I’m a big believer though in creating content that feels loose, and showcases what personalities do best, and the formula this show uses has registered with the audience, while putting the talent in position to showcase their best attributes.
From an individual standpoint, you can hear how much fun Cory has guiding the morning show. He interacts well with his crew, enjoys discussing all aspects of pop culture, politics, music, sports, and everyday issues, and has a strong ability to shift gears and keep the audience on their toes. He also has no problem presenting an opinion or generating a reaction.
A natural entertainer who’s been a big part of KFAN’s success, Cory earns my praise for the way he conducts the show, and for helping it establish its own identity in the Minneapolis market. To hear Cory’s show click here.
AJ Hoffman – 97.5 ESPN Houston – One of the first things I noticed when listening to AJ’s show with Fred Faour was the production value. It’s excellent. Tons of sound, actualities, current and high energy rock music beds, and it all compliments AJ’s style perfectly. With the show on FM (ESPN 97.5) and competing against two familiar AM brands, there’s a big commitment to the presentation and it works. You often hear the term “Old School Meets New School” in the sports radio format, and Fred and AJ are a great example of that dynamic working well.
What I like about AJ as a talent is that he’s very authoritative, energetic, and unfiltered. His background as an MMA fighter probably factors into that. Last week for example he questioned whether or not Texans Head Coach Bill O’Brien was good at his job, and if he deserved the same type of venom from Texas sports fans that Charlie Strong was receiving.
I’ve also heard AJ call out other media personalities who he believes mail in their performance. He’s gone on record and stated that he feels Jim Rome relies on the same tired shtick and needs to modify his material, and whether you agree with him or not, there’s no disputing where he stands, and he doesn’t back down.
AJ also brings a good sense of humor to the airwaves, and looks for opportunities to create laughter on the show. His chemistry with his partner is very strong too. I find myself immersed in the content when he’s delivering his opinions because they’re easy to follow, and delivered with conviction. To hear some of AJ’s work on ESPN 97.5 click here.
Anthony Stalter – 101 ESPN St. Louis – When you’re working for a successful brand that features Bernie Miklasz, Chris Duncan, Randy Karraker, D’Marco Farr, and Kevin Wheeler, it’s easy to get lost in the shuffle. Make no mistake about it though, Anthony is an intracle part of the station’s success.
Having started with the station as a Producer of the afternoon show, Program Director Chris “Hoss” Neupert saw on-air ability in Anthony early on. When the station lost midday host Bernie Miklasz in 2013 (he’s since returned to host morning drive), filling his void was no easy task. Neupert took a gamble, and moved Duncan off of the afternoon show, and gave Stalter his on-air shot as his partner, and two years later the pairing has paid off.
When you listen to Anthony, you take away a number of things. First, he has an excellent voice, and sets the tone for the program. Second, he has a great sense of what the local audience is interested in, and he leads Chris into good situations.
You’ll also hear someone who takes his preparation seriously. That serves him well when discussing baseball topics with Chris. Sometimes it can be difficult for a radio guy to feel confident when they’re sitting across from a partner who’s played the game at the highest level, but Chris values Anthony’s assessments, and that helps build his credibility with the audience.
Anthony understands when to start the content with his own opinion, and push Dunc to respond, but also when to sit back, and let Chris take over. The energy on the show is high, and there’s no shortage of self-deprecation when they screw something up. Because they share a mutual love and interest talking about sports, and their ages aren’t far apart, they connect as a team, and have a lot of fun on the air. To hear Anthony’s show click here.
Chris Kroeger – 610 The Fan Charlotte – When you listen to Chris, you may come away with the opinion that he’s a homer for his local teams, and that’s ok because he admits that he is. The word “we” comes up often when he’s discussing his local teams, and quite frankly, I like that. If you listen to him, you’ll recognize quickly how invested he is in the market’s local teams.
At only 28 years old, Chris is still coming into his own as a personality, but what he’s put together so far is extremely impressive. His energy, enthusiasm, and relatability are easy to detect, and with the show’s format featuring different contributors, he shows he can be a chameleon and adapt to any situation.
In listening to the banter last week between Chris and Mushin Muhammad, you can tell he appreciates the position he’s in, and works hard to pull out great material from those who contribute to the program.
If you’re looking for a talk show host fueled by negativity, Chris won’t be your cup of tea. He looks to present an informative conversation built around finding solutions, and a show that highlights the connection between the host, its guests, and the audience. The pace is fast, his command of the program is strong and easy to follow, and his discussions with his guests are extended and provide great engaged listening.
I also hear a lot of sound utilized during the show. One particular skill Chris possesses is an ability to react well off of it. He uses audio to set up his points and create emotional responses, and when executed that way, it can pay great dividends. To hear Chris’ show click here.
Jonathan Zaslow – 790 The Ticket Miami – If I could only use one word to describe Jonathan, it would be entertaining! His pairing with Joy Taylor on 790 The Ticket makes for a great listen, and one of the best parts of their show is how willing and comfortable each of them are with putting their lives on display for the audience.
Zaslow will attempt voices when the moment calls for it, he’s been hypnotized on the air, and one of the show’s staples, “The wheel of humiliation” puts members of the show in a position to pay the price if they pick NFL games poorly. A few weeks ago Dan Le Batard and Stugotz asked for permission to steal the bit and use it with their national audience, and Jonathan demonstrated in that moment that he can deliver some bite too.
What I like most about his style is that he has fun, great energy, a strong rapport with his crew, and there are no restrictions on what he’ll discuss. He can get into a detailed conversation about the problems with the Heat, or venture into an area that causes your jaw to drop.
For example, yesterday morning he talked about his preference for candle wax over a tickle feather inside the dungeon at his home. Does he really have one? Is he saying something for effect? Perhaps, but it led to some very funny conversation between himself, Joy, and Brett Romberg, and that ability to keep the audience guessing is a real strength.
If you’re commuting to work in Miami, and looking to laugh and learn a little about sports and the characters involved on the morning show, you’ll love what Jonathan brings to the table. The show cares about the local teams, is comfortable in any setting, lets creative content evolve organically, and each member of the show cares about connecting with the audience. To hear Jonathan’s show click here.
Aaron Goldhammer – ESPN 850 WKNR Cleveland – Aaron has been a fixture of the Cleveland sports scene for close to ten years, and his passion, sense of humor, and sarcasm, serve him well in connecting with his audience on WKNR.
He got his start, and developed his personality by working with one of Cleveland’s best personalities Tony Rizzo, and since leaving Rizzo’s show, he’s more than held his own as host of “The Golden Boyz” with Emmett Golden.
It won’t take you long to notice Aaron taking command of the room when he hosts his program. He’s a high volume, and high energy type of talent, and that’s a great fit in a passionate market such as Cleveland. He’ll intertwine sports and pop culture when opportunities arise, and Aaron won’t hesitate to take the audience behind the curtain and give them a sense of the chaos that unfolds with the staff each day.
The music on the program skews younger, and there’s a heavy content focus on Cleveland sports, which is presented with a “pray for the best, but prepare for the worst” type of mindset. That plays right into the emotional spirit of the local fan base and who he is as a local talent. To hear Aaron’s show click here.
Doug Franz – Arizona Sports 98.7FM – There are few local market shows that have enjoyed the longevity, and success that “Doug and Wolf” have in Phoenix. While Ron Wolfley possesses a big personality, and is one of the most entertaining people I’ve listened to in the format, Doug is an exceptional broadcaster who’s skill can be overlooked if you don’t pay attention.
There’s an art to pulling out the best material from an authentic talent like Wolfley, and Franz does it very well. He’s shown over the years that he’s not afraid to stand up and assert his own voice, but he also realizes that getting Wolf going is critical to the show’s success.
I’ve noticed over the years a growing confidence in Doug to assert himself, and start conversations with his own opinion and put Wolf in the reactor position. Early on in the show’s history, there was a bigger focus in getting Wolf’s opinion first, and reacting off of him. That shows growth, trust and understanding in Doug and Wolf’s relationship.
Another area where I’ve seen Doug improve is with his ability to present himself as the expert. He’s done a great job sharing the insight he gains from working on the sidelines during football games, and there was no better example than this past Monday when the show discussed Steve Sarkisian’s alcohol issues. Hearing Doug offer a firsthand account of what he witnessed during the game while working on the sidelines was must listen radio.
Equally deserving credit are his topic selection, pacing, and preparation. On Monday’s show for example, I listened for a full hour and during that period, three quarters of the content revolved around the Arizona Cardinals. There were plenty of other selections to choose from, but instead they played the hits and provided the content that had the largest audience appeal. When hosts approach their segments with the listener’s best interest in mind, they usually win, and Doug and Wolf have done a lot of it. To hear Doug’s show click here.
Chris Vernon – 92.9 ESPN Memphis – Originally from St. Louis, Chris has been a fixture on the Memphis airwaves since 2004. I became aware of him when I started working in Missouri in 2006. Three years later when I was building 101 ESPN, he was one of the first people I reached out to about possibly joining the radio station.
While that situation didn’t materialize, one of the biggest reasons I was interested is because he always sounds like he’s having fun. Chris has an infectious energy, genuine interest in sports, presents himself as the voice of the local sports fan, and his interviews with high profile guests often sound like conversations between two friends.
A good example of this is when Grizzlies GM Chris Wallace appears on his program. While some shows spend 10-12 minutes with a guest, hit the important stuff and then move on, Chris won’t hesitate to keep a guest for 30-40 minutes if they’re interesting. His chats with Wallace often run longer, and never feel fatiguing.
If there’s another area of his game that stands out, it’s his understanding and willingness to embrace the responsibility of working with clients and helping them earn business. This comes from having worn multiple hats and performed as an on-air talent, and sales person. Personalities who’ve done both jobs develop an appreciation for how difficult it is, and they usually do a better job on the air with helping clients experience success.
I find that Chris is more likely to inform and entertain than divide an audience with his opinions, and he likes to use music throughout the show to add flavor to it. You’ll also hear produced pieces utilized when guests appear, which I think adds a nice touch. To hear Chris’ show on 92.9 ESPN click here.
Grant Paulsen – 106.7 The Fan Washington DC – In sports radio circles outside of Washington DC, Grant is still an unknown commodity, but he might be familiar to you if you were a viewer of the David Letterman Show. As a child, Grant contributed to the late night program, and while that made him familiar to national audiences, it’s the work he’s doing now with Danny Rouhier on 106.7 The Fan that I’m most impressed by.
First, he comes across on the air as a very likeable personality. He’s emotionally invested in the local market’s teams, and his preparation and ability to provide you with something you didn’t know is very strong. As the point guard of the show, he navigates the program smoothly, and keeps a good steady pace. I also enjoy the chemistry that exists between him and Danny.
What I’m even more impressed by is how easy he makes it for the audience to tune in and follow along. His teasing is fantastic, but his ability to pay it off is even stronger. Nothing frustrates audiences more, than sitting through commercials to hear a host provide an answer to something they teased, only to not receive what they were promised.
On Tuesday for example Grant referenced the situation in NY where a caller cried on Mike Francesa’s show. He promised to play the audio, and offer his and Danny’s thoughts on the last time sports made them cry. When the show returned from break, Grant immediately reset the story, played the audio, and discussed the Jeffrey Maier incident during the Yankees-Orioles playoff game in 1996, and how it made them both emotional. They then gave a few more examples, and asked the audience to share their stories, and the result was ten good minutes of radio. The following segment led in with Faith Hill’s “Cry” which demonstrated that the production team is in sync with the hosts, and have a great sense of how to use music, and sound to compliment the content.
While these things may not seem like a big deal to some, it’s that type of execution, and entertainment value that keeps shows winning. When great ability and chemistry are combined with a smart approach to creating good radio, good results follow. To hear Grant’s show click here.
Chris Mueller – 93.7 The Fan Pittsburgh – In 2008 Chris won a competition called “Top Fan” on the now defunct “ESPN 1250” which gave him his radio break. 7 years later, he’s taken hold of afternoon drive on 93.7 The Fan with Joe Starkey, and shows no signs of slowing down anytime soon.
Don’t let the youthful photo fool you. While Chris still has his best years ahead of him, when you tune into his program, he sounds like an experienced pro. He’s got a very strong delivery, and presence, and is well spoken. He lives and breathes Pittsburgh sports, and puts a heavy emphasis on Steelers content which shows he’s in tune with what moves the audience most.
The Starkey and Mueller show comes across as a program which has been together for years, yet has only been in place since February 2013. When you single out Chris, you hear a confident personality who is quick on his feet, brash, unapologetic, and asks the questions that local fans are thinking about. While Starkey may be one of the best and most respected sports figures in the market, Chris doesn’t let that stop him from establishing his own voice.
His opinions often produce the largest response, his energy is excellent, and his emotional connection to the local teams serve him well and are a big reason why The Fan’s future remains very bright. To hear Chris’ show click here.
Brent Dougherty – 104.5 The Zone Nashville – A little known fact is that The Zone in Nashville is one of the highest rated sports stations in the country. The afternoon show 3HL (Three Hour Lunch) which is hosted by Brent Dougherty, Mickey Ryan, and former NFL defensive back Blaine Bishop, is a big reason for it.
What makes it work is the comradery that exists between the three personalities. Ryan joined the mix only thirteen months ago, and prior to his arrival, the multi-talented Clay Travis was part of the program for five years. Regardless of the talent mix, the show has moved along like a freight train and continued to dominate the market.
Although he could pat himself on the back for what the show has accomplished, that’s not how Brent operates. On one of his profiles he states that the daily goal for 3HL is to make sure it is the most fun, fast paced, highly interactive, opinion driven and creative sports talk radio show possible. If you listen to it, you can hear it check those boxes pretty frequently.
Despite the program offering three distinct personalities, Brent does a few specific things to stand out. First, he’s been blessed with an incredible set of pipes. His voice is full and helps him distinguish himself on the show.
Second, he does a really good job of interacting with his partners, and callers, and his warm personality makes him easy to listen to. He presents subjects that suit the audience’s interests, and Blaine and Mickey trust, and follow his lead, especially during interviews.
As it relates to conversations with guests, he asks good questions, and treats those who appear on the show with respect, and makes them feel comfortable. They in turn provide him with good information. I heard three different examples of this working to perfection.
He had Michelle Beadle explain why she wanted to appear on Sharknado. He led Ernest Byner into talking like a pirate, and he got Charissa Thompson to fire a few friendly jabs at former partner Clay Travis, and express her appreciation for Eddie George’s male model looks.
While the show performs well because of the trio, it’s clear that Brent is the engine that moves it along. His influence and ability to direct the show expertly are a big reason for its success. To hear Brent’s show click here.
Danny Parkins – 610 Sports Kansas City – I first became aware of Danny when he was hosting his own program in Syracuse, NY and I describe him as one of those talents who is wise beyond his years. Paired with Carrington “CDot” Harrison on 610 Sports in Kansas City, the duo have an infectious energy and passion that has catapulted their program to the top of the ratings in afternoon drive.
When you listen to him, you can hear a talent who has a great handle on how to run a show. He’s focused with his opinions, and delivers them with confidence, but doesn’t belabor his points. He presents content that has the largest appeal to the local audience, and finds different ways to approach topics and keep himself and his partner engaged. He’ll use additional evidence to help defend his positions, but isn’t afraid to acknowledge when he’s wrong, and make fun of himself.
For example, I caught the opening thirty minutes of the show yesterday to hear how local fans were reacting the day after the Royals knocked off the Astros and advanced to the ALCS. From the opening production piece (which was absolutely brilliant) assembled by producer Ben Heisler, to the opening conversation between Danny and Carrington about how wrong they were about Johnny Cueto, it was some of the best content available in the format, period! If you have fifteen minutes to spare, go take a listen for yourself. Here’s the link.
What I enjoy and appreciate about Danny is how seriously he treats his position. I hear resets inside the content, teases to leave the audience pondering the answer, and a solid understanding of how to get the best out his partner, while still getting his own touches. When you add in the fact that he’s originally from Chicago but has embraced the local market, and made it his own, you can see why he’s had success. To hear Danny’s show click here.
Michael Grady – The Fan Indianapolis – He’s the public-address announcer for the Indiana Pacers, but his soothing tones on Emmis’ Indianapolis sports station “The Fan”, are where he’s making his biggest impact.
What’s impressive about Michael, is that he’s still under thirty years old, yet sounds mature beyond his years. He’s a guy who has paid his dues behind the scenes before getting his on-air shot alongside former NFL player Joe Staysniak, but if you listen to him host his show, you’ll recognize quickly that he was born to be on a microphone.
What I love about Michael is how smooth and upbeat he sounds when hosting his program. He has this certain swagger with his delivery that jumps through the speakers, and he comes across as a likeable and approachable human being. He’s respectful when interacting with his partner and high profile sports figures, but firm when necessary. That approach carries over to the way he interacts with his callers too
One of my favorite segments is when former NFL and College Football Coach Rick Venturi stops by. Rick is a savant when it comes to the subject of football, and Michael does an excellent job of asking good questions, and knowing when to push for more. Their rapport is strong, and I’m sure it leads to an increase in local listening.
When you combine those traits with strong knowledge and a deep passion for Indianapolis sports, you have a winning combination. To hear Michael’s show click here.
Guy Haberman – 95.7 The Game San Francisco – I may be a little biased here because I discovered Guy in Fresno, and hired him at 95.7 The Game, but I believe he’s an incredible talent who’s just starting to hit the prime of his career.
When I scouted him in Fresno I was drawn in by his preparation, maturity, likeability, and polished presentation. My initial reaction was that I was listening to a young Dan Patrick. At that time, Guy was 27, and had only been on the air as a host for a few years, but he sounded as if he’d been doing the job for 10-12 years. I brought him into San Francisco to host evenings, and his skill and work ethic have since led him into middays, pre/post on Sacramento Kings games on Comcast television, play by play for the Pac-12 Network, and play by play duties on Oakland Athletics broadcasts.
What I think makes Guy a special talent on the air, is that he doesn’t talk down to the audience, and his love for sports is genuine and comes across in everything he does. It doesn’t matter what sport is on television and which team’s are playing. If an athletic competition is taking place, he’s likely to watch it and take something away from the experience.
His chemistry and friendship with his on-air partner John Middlekauff also can’t be taught. Their connection off the air is even stronger than the one they share on the air, and that friendship, and understanding of each other is a big reason why the show has gone as high as #1 in the ratings.
Overall you’ll find excellent content selection, good interviews, a smart and informed sports conversation, and a good positive vibe when you listen to him. To hear Guy’s show click here.
Gavin Dawson – 105.3 The Fan – Without a doubt, Gavin is one of the most polished and smooth lead hosts anywhere in the country. He carries the moniker “The General” which perfectly describes his role on the show. You can listen minute by minute and feel the program moving into interesting content areas, and that’s often the result of Gavin’s decision making.
Keep in mind, he drives this show for five hours, and has to control it while working with a large cast. The show includes Chris Arnold, Mike Bacsik, and Jeff Cavanaugh, and Gavin won’t hesitate to pull in other cast members if he feels they can add something of value to the show.
I think the crew do an incredible job of picking their spots, avoiding stepping on each other, and allowing the flow of the conversation to develop. There seems to be a mindset of “we” rather than “me” which is important. I noticed that each host gets their touches, and when they do, the interjections are delivered in short bursts. This keeps the content moving, and prevents the program from becoming fatiguing.
One of Gavin’s best attributes is his ability to decipher when the show needs an in-depth discussion on a serious sports issue, and when a couple of laughs are necessary. As a radio lifer, I respect how committed he is to executing the formatics, and how prepared he is heading in and out of his breaks. For example, I listened on October 1st, and during the final hour of the show, these were his teases:
Dirk Nowitzki doesn’t want one of “those” when he retires…we’ll explain next!
It’s been a couple of weeks but next it’s time for letters from prison with Jeff Cavanaugh
There’s a TMZ story about Dez Bryan’t finances that you’re going to want to hear about
In each situation, he never gave away the answer and kept the audience curious. Then when the program returned from its commercial breaks, they dove into the story within 2-3 seconds. The only time it didn’t occur was during the last segment when Gavin explained that the Dez Bryant story would be covered, but first they needed to call an audible and deal with a breaking news story surrounding a mass shooting at a college in Oregon.
In listening to Gavin’s approach, topic selections, and mixture of proving serious sports talk and light hearted entertainment, it’s no surprise the show has taken the lead in middays in the Dallas market. To hear Gavin’s show click here.
OTHER HOSTS WORTH SAMPLING:
Ronnie Lane – 620 WDAE, Tampa, FL
Nick Bahe – 1620 The Zone, Omaha, NE
Cecil Lammey – 105.5 ESPN, Denver, CO
Rob Long – 105.7 The Fan, Baltimore, MD
Brent Axe – ESPN Syracuse, Syracuse, NY
Mark Zinno – 92.9 The Game, Atlanta, GA
Cam Cleeland – 1080 The Fan, Portland, OR
Phil Mackey – 1500 ESPN, Minneapolis, MN
Matt Moscona – 104.5 ESPN, Baton Rouge, LA
Anthony Rothman – 97.1 The Fan, Columbus, OH
Matt Jones – Kentucky Sports Radio, Lexington, KY
Mike Meltser – Sports Radio 610 KILT, Houston, TX
Carrington Harrison – 610 Sports, Kansas City, MO
Gordon Monson – 1280 The Zone, Salt Lake City, UT
Joe Fortenbaugh – 95.7 The Game, San Francisco, CA
Over the past two years, a rapid interest has developed in podcasting. While it’s actually been available for years, and personalities such as Bill Simmons and Adam Carolla have enjoyed great success in the space, the commitment from advertisers, broadcast companies, and personalities has grown significantly.
One program which influenced a change in perception of podcasting was the show “Serial“. The program focused on an investigation into the 1999 murder of Hae Min Lee, an 18-year-old student in Baltimore, Maryland. Lee’s ex-boyfriend, Adnan Masud Syed was arrested and charged with first-degree murder, but his first trial ended in a mistrial. After a six-week second trial, Syed was found guilty of Lee’s murder and given a life sentence, despite pleading his innocence.
In February 2015, three weeks after the end of Serial’s first season, the Maryland Court of Special Appeals filed a decision allowing Syed to appeal his conviction. The Court also announced that another three-judge panel would address the question of whether new evidence from an alibi of Syed’s, would be admitted.
The interest in the case, and the information learned on the program, pushed Serial’s season one downloads to over sixty eight million. With the rise in popularity came a large amount of mainstream media coverage, which helped the show gain an extension for two more seasons.
Although Serial made a major splash, it isn’t the only program to experience massive success in the podcasting world. Other popular personalities like Joe Rogan, the Sklar Brothers, Shaquille O’Neal, and pro wrestlers “Stone Cold” Steve Austin and Chris Jericho, have taken their talents to the podcasting arena too, and gained strong followings.
Comedian Marc Maron is another personality who delivers a strong audience. To date, his podcast has been downloaded more than one hundred million times. It was also the first podcast to welcome the President of the United States Barack Obama as a guest.
Recently, CBS Money Watch said advertising on podcasts had grown to the tune of thirty four million dollars annually. PodcastOne Chairman Norm Pattiz (who’s company sells ad time for Carolla’s show), believes its closer to fifty million. He said “If it were $34 million, we’d be way over 50 percent of the business, and I don’t believe that we are“.
With advertiser interest growing, more personalities wanting in, and audiences displaying a heavier appetite for the content, is there a stark difference between podcasting and radio? Sometimes in our industry we latch on to new things, or reimage old ones to become excited again, but in this case, I do believe there are some big differences.
In the past week alone, I consumed fourteen different podcasts to gain a sense of what each program’s recipe was for serving their audience. What I found was that each program was different, and that alone fueled my desire to learn more about the platform’s approach.
The programs I listened to were:
The Big Podcast with Shaq and John Kincade
The Adam Carolla Show
The Stinkin Truth with Mark Schlereth
Talk Is Jericho
The Tony Bruno Show
The Ross Report
The Bill Simmons Podcast
The SI Media Podcast with Richard Deitsch
Sklarboro Country
Bernie and Randy
Franco and Kags
Dennis and Callahan’s Breaking Balls Podcast
Radio Stuff with Larry Gifford
The Podcast About Sports Radio with Zach McCrite
In comparison to radio, there were a number of similarities, but there also were some major differences. I put a chart together to outline some of those items.
SUBJECT
SPORTS RADIO
SPORTS PODCASTS
CONTENT & FORMULA
Follows a Clock & Format
Free Flowing & No Rules
SHOW LENGTHS
2-4 Hours
30-90 Minutes
DISTRIBUTION
Everyday
1-2x per week
ORIGINAL PROGRAMS
Set Lineups M-F
Tons of Variety
SPORTS UPDATES
2-3X Per Hour
Rarely any
COMMERCIAL BREAKS
3-4 Per Hour
Rarely any
COMMERCIAL TIME
12-20 Minutes Per Hour
Rarely any
LIVE READS/MENTIONS
Avg. of 2-3X Per Hour
Avg. of 2-3X per episode
REVENUE UPSIDE
High/Lots of opportunities
Low/Limited opportunities
SUCCESS MEASURED
Nielsen Ratings
Total downloads/Time Spent Per Episode
If you’re an audio listener, and you spend two hours, one with a radio program, and the other with a podcast, you’ll receive much more content from a podcast. Commercials are not part of the strategy, and because they don’t consistently interrupt the flow of the shows, it’s a major benefit for the audience.
Some other positives include the show lengths which are usually 30-60 minutes. Most commuters can consume an entire show during a drive to or from work. There’s no feeling of “I’m going to miss out“. It’s more in line with television’s approach to programming. Those who listen to a podcast, are likely to listen to others too.
The opportunity to listen to long segments, unfiltered discussions, and gain a peek behind the curtain are other reasons to listen. This allows the talent to be comfortable and authentic. For example, when I listened to Adam Carolla, he got into some very explicit discussions on sex. If the same show had aired on terrestrial radio, Adam either would’ve avoided the subject or presented a PG/R rated version. If he said what he did on his podcast, he would have been suspended or fired, and his employer would’ve been subject to an FCC fine.
What I really enjoyed hearing was how loose most of the personalities were, and how unscripted the programming was. In certain cases I heard shows welcome guests who I’m positive would’ve been declined on local radio stations because they didn’t play into the strategy of delivering ratings. Certain interviews also provided interesting nuggets of information because the discussions were allowed to materialize, and weren’t trying to fit inside an allotted amount of segment time.
There were three great examples of this that jumped out to me.
First, John Kincade and Shaq had a conversation with Kobe Bryant that was as good as gold. If you haven’t heard it, do yourself a favor and check it out. It was fascinating because Shaq and Kobe were able to relax, and reminisce without it feeling like they were under the microscope, and John had a great sense of when to get involved and when to sit out.
Because the environment was soothing for Shaq and Kobe, the interview entered areas that I don’t believe it would’ve had it taken place on a local radio station. If you have the time to listen, it’s worth it. Make sure also to listen after the interview to the conversation between John and Shaq about “Deez Nuts“. It’s very entertaining.
The second piece to produce a similar result was Richard Deitsch’s podcast with WWE personality Paul Heyman. There was no time limit on the discussion which kept it from feeling rushed, and because Richard does his homework, he’s able to get into certain areas with his guests, and pull things out of them that a listener can appreciate. Hearing Paul discuss how he prepares for his next promo on Raw, why he connects with eloquent people, and how he feels about professional wrestling gaining more mainstream media coverage was very insightful.
The last example I want to highlight was from Larry Gifford’s Radio Stuff podcast. His subject was the rise and fall of Cumulus Media, and he utilized a lot of audio clips in it to help him tell an interesting story. What jumped out the most though was his conversation with Tom Leykis. When I heard Tom say “Cumulus is one of the prime murderers of the broadcasting business” I was intrigued.
Tom then shared his personal account of how Cumulus treated him during negotiations, and how their approach pushed him away from returning to the radio business. While I wasn’t privy to his situation, and am sure there’s another side to it, I felt like I was in the room because of the way he presented it. It was a riveting piece of audio, and one that I don’t believe I’d hear on a local radio show.
While each of those examples above highlights the many benefits being provided by podcasts, I also discovered some negatives.
First, nothing is more aggravating as a content consumer than clicking on a button to hear a show, and then having to wait two minutes for the personality to start the program. This happens because the hosts are reading ads right out of the gate. While I understand the challenge of generating revenue on these programs, this will become a bigger issue for advertisers in the future.
The biggest reason is because every time a program starts with a talent reading a sponsor message, I fast forward past it. One of the great tools of digital listening, is that you have more control over the way you consume it. When you’re in the car, you either endure commercials, and sponsor mentions, or you change the channel, and hope to return to the station, and not miss anything important. When you’re at your computer or listening on your phone, you can skip to the good stuff, and eliminate the bad.
It’s very similar in my opinion to the DVR. If you record a television show and watch it back, you’re more likely to skip past the commercials than sit through them. The same holds true when listening to a podcast. I’m sure advertisers would rather not hear that.
Sticking with business, I did find my recall of advertisers was higher with podcasting than with radio. On podcasts, sponsors are woven into the programming during select times, and because the interruptions are fewer, and shorter, I sat through them, and remembered them.
There’s also a positive vibe you feel towards the client because they’ve invested in a unique show that you listen to. You want to reward them for that association. I also heard many hosts supporting their clients, and providing good strong personalized reads, rather than breezing past them as we often hear on radio shows.
If I can keep my critical cap on for a moment, I’ll add that because the programming is often recorded, and not touching on LIVE events, there is less of a feeling of urgency to consume it. If listeners don’t check back often, and traffic decreases, that could hurt revenue.
Another challenge that can’t be ignored is that podcasts offer less programming than local radio shows. Top flight personalities on radio provide fifteen to twenty hours of content per week, while podcasts deliver one to two hours. If you’re in the advertising world, that means less opportunity on podcasts, and more opportunity on radio.
There was one one other tidbit I picked up on that I felt was worth a mention. It applies to the difference in the way the podcasts are presented. Certain talents like Deitsch, the Sklar Brothers, Jericho, Austin, and Simmons, present their shows differently than Bruno, Gifford, McCrite, and Bernie and Randy.
This stems from some podcasters being radio personalities who are used to delivering content a certain way, and others more focused on talking, and less worried about structure and presentation. I can list the pros and cons for each approach, but the one you’ll gravitate towards is the one that appeals to your personal tastes.
For those personalities I listened to who are working for local radio stations, I appreciate them providing something different on their podcasts than what they treat listeners to over the airwaves. That’s very important.
For example, in the case of Bernie and Randy, they don’t do a daily radio show together. Both men are popular to St. Louis sports fans, and occupy drive time slots on 101 ESPN, and by creating the podcast, it brings them together once per week. This helps the station offer a unique program on its digital platform, which gives listeners an extra incentive to visit.
If there’s one piece of advice I can pass along to those who partake in creating podcasts, make sure you’re providing a different experience online than the one you present on-air. Taking your radio program, posting it online, and calling it a podcast is not accurate. Promoting that the show is available on-demand on the website is fine, but podcasts are different. Based on these numbers from Triton, you can see why it’s important to be in this space, and offer original programming.
Earlier in this column I asked if there was a big difference between podcasting and radio, and in my opinion it’s a complicated answer. From the content standpoint, there’s little difference. It’s still programming built around people sharing opinions, stories, and parts of their lives that make them interesting. The format may be different, but it’s still an audio broadcast.
Where things change is when you analyze the business, and content creation strategies. Are personalities providing too much content on radio by broadcasting fifteen to twenty hours per week? If the average listener in a top 5 market consumes thirty to forty minutes per day, does the additional time matter?
How much of that programming time is spent on creating memorable content versus filling air time with calls, and serviceable material? With attention spans shrinking daily, I wonder if we’ll see a shift towards short-focused programming, and a reduction in long-form content.
As far as business is concerned, if commercials aren’t included, and sponsor reads are limited, then how much more money can the platform generate? Downloads, and time spent listening may increase, and that will help the narrative when requesting higher premiums, but there’s still a lack of inventory, and not enough regular programming. Unless that changes, or listeners start paying to consume the content, I struggle to see how the revenue gains will be significant.
If you’re a listener, that’s not your issue. You should love what’s happening with podcasting. You get to enjoy a lot of great talent, content without disruptions, and insight into situations that don’t have a chance to materialize often on local radio. You can also consume it faster which leaves you time for other things that are important in your daily life, and because the programming is offered weekly or bi-weekly, you typically are treated to something good.
As you can see on the image above, younger audiences are growing up listening this way. If this becomes the future of audio delivery, then media companies better start figuring out how to monetize it better.
From where I sit, I believe podcasting provides enormous opportunity. CBS and Hubbard Radio have already entered the fray by making sizeable investments, and I expect other groups to follow suit in the future.
The only thing debatable in my mind is whether or not the platform can tip the scale for broadcast companies, and become the additional revenue stream they need to pull themselves out of the abyss they’ve been stuck in for the past decade.
Is this a fifty million dollar business that will experience slight economic growth? Or is it a model that’s representative of the future, and will deliver ten to fifteen times it’s current number? That’s radio’s problem to solve, not the audience’s. They’re doing their part by showing up and supporting it.
It’s evening time. You’ve arrived home from work, ate your dinner, and are finally unwinding and getting ready to watch your television. If you work in the sports media business, that likely means watching some form of sports programming.
You absorb the content, and before you know it, you’re reaching for your phone, iPad, or laptop, and logging on to one of your social media accounts to see what others are saying about the program you’re watching.
As you start reading the comments, they get your juices flowing. Soon you have the itch to type a response, and engage in the conversation. After all, you get paid to talk, and interact with people on your show each day, and you have bosses, and the entire media industry telling you how vital it is to connect with the audience outside of your show to build deeper fan loyalty.
And then it happens…..you press send, and offer an opinion that gets the whole world talking, and not for the right reason.
The responses to your opinion start coming in rapidly. Your audience begins sharing and retweeting your commentary, and soon the media industry, one which you make your living in, is now highlighting your opinion, and seeking your removal and/or an apology.
You start to panic, and think “maybe I can delete the comment and this will all go away“. Except, it’s been saved at this point by numerous outlets, and you recognize that it’s going to spread like a virus no matter what you do.
Then you ponder “what if I just apologize, and promise not to do it again“? That sounds good in theory, but the damage has already been done, and the dogs are lined up outside the door, and barking, and not going away until they taste blood.
As you contemplate the chaos you’re involved in, you decide to reach out to your boss, and let them know what’s transpired, so they know the situation, and understand your role in it. Whether you get along great or terribly with this individual is irrelevant, because you know the conversation is necessary.
Together you discuss the next steps for handling the storm, and when you go to sleep that night, you’re hopeful to wake up the next day and have it all be just a dream. Except it isn’t, and the nightmare isn’t close to being over.
Then the phone call comes in. It’s likely your Program Director, or it might even be your General Manager, or CEO, asking for more details on what took place.
You offer your thoughts on the situation, and explain how you were simply taking part in a conversation with the audience outside of the show, and offered an opinion that wasn’t well received. But you do this all the time on your show, so this shouldn’t be any different right?
Your boss listens to you, probably takes some notes, and tells you they’ll be in touch afterwards to discuss what to do next.
At this point you’re stressed out, blaming yourself (or the audience who outed you) for putting your commentary on social media, and you’re walking on egg shells waiting to hear how the company wants to proceed.
And then the phone call comes…..you’ve been suspended or fired.
Instantly you’re asking your employers to reconsider. You’re pissed off at the audience for making a big deal out of what you thought was an innocent comment. You’re feeling embarrassed and uncomfortable about your future because you know this blemish is now going to hang over your head like a dark black cloud.
And as I sit here laying out this scenario for you, I have one simple question I want you to answer – did it make any sense at all to participate on social media?
Some people will immediately say “well if you weren’t stupid and didn’t say those things, you wouldn’t be in this predicament“. That’s true. I often read some personalities social media responses and question their line of judgment because I know that they’re on the verge of unflattering attention for a pointless reason.
I also recognize though that some of the most opinionated people in our business, performers who by the way drive ratings, and command big advertising endorsement rates (and offer similar commentaries on-air that they’re now being attacked for using on social media), don’t always handle things properly. I don’t want to excuse personal responsibility because it should factor into the equation.
But let’s also recognize that people are human, and they do have flaws, and make mistakes.
Here’s a cold reality. In every industry, there are people who’s views, character traits, and decisions, will make you uneasy. You see them as the lowest form of scum, while others see them in a different light.
When it comes to social circles, we gravitate towards those we like, but still we focus our additional energies on people we don’t identify with. As petty as it may be, we spend a lot of time and negative energy analyzing what other people say and do.
That today has become one of the most powerful seductions for Twitter and Facebook. You wake up, read your timeline, and you interact with those you like, and then proceed to talk or complain about a couple of others who posted something that you don’t agree with.
Is it really important? No. But in today’s world, we’re consumed with everyone’s opinion, and we feel an immediate need to dive into everyone else’s conversation.
That doesn’t make social media bad. Instead it calls into question our own abilities to operate with a filter. We want to be ourselves, and speak freely without consequence, and when you’re communicating with people you have established relationships with, that may be acceptable. When you’re presenting your views though to those you share no personal history with, that’s a different ballgame.
It’s our own personal responsibility to assess whether it makes sense to respond, or walk away from certain conversations. Unfortunately, most of us can’t help to stop and look at the car crash, rather than continue driving.
Personally, I enjoy social media, and many of the benefits it provides. But I’m also not on the air, and I don’t command the same attention that an on-air personality does. If I were working in that position, and had every one of my assessments being scrutinized, as much as I love being social, and connecting with people, I’d have to think twice about my level of activity, and what I hoped to gain by being accessible on it.
I know that may sound crazy since every media company today preaches the importance of social media, and why it’s necessary to be active, but let me ask you this – how much money have you or your brand made off of Twitter? How about Facebook?
If your best personalities can’t turn off their emotions (which by the way, you love and push for more of when they’re on the air), and have a rational conversation on social media without torching their own career and your brand in the process, then is it really worth it to be on there in the first place?
These are highly emotional, and opinionated people, and we send them into the lion’s den, but ask them to play nice. Each day they log on to their accounts, and share their personal beliefs, and invite the world in, while enduring public criticisms, and personal attacks. We then expect them not to be brash or irrational with their responses when faced with negativity. While we may want all talent to flip a switch, and avoid confrontation over meaningless drama, not everyone marches to the same beat.
I want to understand this, and approach the conversation strictly from a business point of view for a second, because remember, this is a business, and everything we do comes back to the almighty dollar.
If you make little to no money by being on Twitter, and the same holds true for your presence on Facebook, yet you stand to lose your livelihood if you make a mistake on one of these platforms, then can someone please tell me why it makes any sense at all to be candid, engaged, and heavily involved in these social spaces?
The risk certainly seems to outweigh the reward.
I’ve heard certain personalities who choose not to participate in social media, say that they believe that by sharing their lives and opinions outside their show, it takes away from the mystery of their programs, and could potentially cost them additional audience. While I don’t necessarily agree with all of that (I can make a case that by promoting yourself, and your show on social media it can lead to an increase in tune-ins), I do understand their point, and concern.
A talent makes their money on the air. Their ratings determine whether or not they get to continue doing it. If speaking your mind in other locations takes away from the allure of what you’ll offer on your show, then I can understand why there’d be hesitation to participate. Some managers may frown upon that, but this is why you can’t treat every personality the same.
What I don’t understand though is why we all feel the need to be in these spaces, and why we continue to think that our comments on social media aren’t seen by all, and potentially damaging. I’ve sat back and watched some personalities swear, ridicule and insult listeners, and trash other companies, yet they wouldn’t do most of that on their own airwaves. They’re not being paid by these social media outlets to be outspoken, but still they feel the need to express themselves more candidly here, than they often do on their own radio stations.
Here’s a newsflash for every on-air personality, and public figure, Twitter and Facebook are no different than your radio or television station. When you type a comment, and press send, your opinion enters the social media universe, which is equal to grabbing the microphone, and saying something offensive that leads to the FCC or your own company taking action against you. You may think that it’s this fun little platform where you can be yourself and have colorful conversations, but it’s not.
I personally think Mike made a terrible error, and he said some things that were insensitive and stupid. The station had every right to suspend him, and I applaud them for taking action.
I also think his analysis of Jessica Mendoza was off base. As a Yankees fan, I watched that game, and was curious to see how she’d perform, and I came away from that broadcast extremely impressed. She was sharp, well spoken, easy to follow, made excellent points and counterpoints, and proved that she belonged on that stage.
Yes her involvement as an analyst on a baseball broadcast is foreign territory, and as we’ve seen so many times, change isn’t accepted quickly. The immediate response from most people is to complain, and reject any new idea until it’s proven to be socially acceptable.
What I learned from this story, is that Jessica has a lot of talent, and class, and she lets her work speak for her. If you browse her Twitter account, you’ll find most of her tweets promote something she’s involved in, or she’s retweeting something positive. That’s a smart approach. By steering clear of controversial discussions, it keeps her in control, and unlikely to be in a position to have to explain herself to her bosses, or even worse, the entire country.
On the other hand, there are so many others that can’t hit the delete button, and have put themselves in hot water by using poor judgment on social media.
In the past week alone, Mike Bell was suspended, a social media staffer for the Texas Rangers was fired after posting a remark about Texas Head Football Coach Charlie Strong on the team’s Twitter account, and one of the world’s most powerful media moguls Rupert Murdoch was under the microscope for a tweet where he said “Ben and Candy Carson terrific. What about a real black President who can properly address the racial divide? And much else.”
If you’re keeping score, that’s one media person suspended, another fired, and another publicly embarrassed and likely to face some advertiser backlash, all because they used poor judgment on social media platforms.
So I ask these questions again – why are you on there, and is it really worth it?
If the risk means losing your career, or being publicly embarrassed, and there’s no money or career advancement coming your way from being active on it, then why do it?
What brings this full circle for me is that we focused a lot of attention this week on the Mike Bell-Jessica Mendoza controversy, but it never should have even been a topic of conversation in the first place. If Curt Schilling, hadn’t taken to social media, and performed like Mike Bell, Jessica Mendoza wouldn’t have been in that position to draw a reaction.
Which goes to show that when you follow Mendoza’s example, and use social media in small doses, and for the right reasons, you avoid dangerous situations, make a lot of money, and professionally benefit. Bell and Schilling should be taking notice of that, not just her performance in a baseball booth! Although that too may cause future problems for Curt.
The interest in sports radio personalities, programming, and industry information has grown rapidly over the past few years. This site’s existence is proof of it.
When I launched this website in June 2014, I had no idea it would generate the amount of interest, and attention that it has. I was simply looking to do a little bit of writing, offer some advice to help some people in the industry, and have some fun promoting our format, and the people who work in it. I was running a radio station at that time, so making this my top focus wasn’t an option.
Interesting enough, one of my friends and former employees, Zach McCrite, who hosts weekdays from 9am-Noon on 107.7 The Franchise in Oklahoma City, was going through a similar situation. He was looking for a sports radio podcast to listen to so he could learn more about other top personalities in the format, except when he went searching, he couldn’t find anything.
Rather than sit around and wait for the day to come when someone decided to finally do it, Zach got busy, and launched “The Podcast About Sports Radio” in March 2015. His first guest was me, so you can tell how low he set the bar, but as the months have passed, he’s done a great job landing some conversations with some of the industry’s best.
What I liked more than anything about Zach taking on this project, was that he was trying something new, and doing his part to help promote our format. If there’s one pet peeve of mine today, it’s how hard some people have to be pushed just to promote themselves and their brands.
When it comes to business, I’m known to ask “how can we make this better“, “what’s missing“, and “where’s the opportunity“. I use that same approach in the way I manage this website.
I want the information I post to be of value to those who come here. I want the grammar to be accurate, the news to be posted in a timely fashion, and I want to provide a presentation that reflects what’s happening all across the country in the sports media business. I hope that I’ve provided that for you during the past sixteen months.
If there’s one challenge, it’s finding the time to keep up. I don’t have a staff, I have me. As great as it would be to have extra editors, and writers, that’s not realistic. Add in the responsibilities of working with clients, talking to people throughout the industry, and finding some time in between all of the chaos to be available to my family, and you get a sense of the challenges I face.
I’m not complaining though. This is a true labor of love, and it’s with me when I wake up, as well as when I go to sleep.
As much as I enjoy writing and featuring the top sports media stories across the nation, I did feel the website could benefit by having more audio available. I considered launching a podcast, but knowing my professional and personal schedules, I knew I wouldn’t be able to provide it consistently.
So I started to thinking, “how else could I solve the website’s audio problem“?
If I was going to partner with someone, and put my brand name behind it, I wanted to make sure that it was good, done consistently, and provided by someone I know, respect, and trust. Zach McCrite checks all those boxes.
I’ve known Zach ever since I sprung a surprise history of St. Louis sports quiz on him in a restaurant in Louisville in February 2011, while he was interviewing with me for a job at 101 ESPN. He tells everyone who will listen that I gave him his break, but truth be told, the audience did that. I just provided the platform for him to entertain.
Having five years of history together doesn’t hurt, but I’ve also paid attention to his work with “The Podcast About Sports Radio” and I admired how engaged he was in doing it. It wasn’t a case of trying something out, and getting tired of it. Instead he seemed energized with each week’s episode.
We started talking about each of our platforms, and how they had grown since we first launched them, but what made little sense, was how we were both offering content to similar audiences, yet asking those people to find it in two different places. As much as we all enjoy having our own thing, presenting our work to the largest number of people possible should be the ultimate goal.
Together we covered a number of issues, found common ground, and decided it would benefit us both, and all sports radio fans, to work together again.
Today I am pleased to announce that we have formed a partnership, and all previous episodes, and future episodes of “The Podcast About Sports Radio” will be available here on www.barrettsportsmedia.com. There are thirty one previous episodes loaded for your enjoyment, plus a brand new installment (episode #32) with one of the real good guys of the format, ESPN Radio host Bob Valvano. Make sure to give it a listen.
By joining forces, this helps solve the website’s audio issue, and it gives those of you who frequent the website another reason to check in and enjoy content. For Zach, the increased attention from people inside and outside the industry benefits him too, plus he earns a little more time with his family since he doesn’t have to operate his own website on a daily basis.
More importantly though, you benefit! Instead of having to dig in multiple places to find written stories, opinion pieces, and podcasts with popular sports radio personalities, you can now find it all in one place.
I do want to point out that Zach and I are also working on some additional audio offerings that will differ from the regular podcast presentation. Future announcements will be available on the website at the proper time. If you have any suggestions of things you’d like to see/hear in the future, please email me here or Zach here.
I appreciate you dropping by today, as well as during the past sixteen months. I hope that the addition of “The Podcast About Sports Radio” provides even more incentive to return in the future.
If there’s one thing you can do to help us, it’s this – tell a friend, retweet or share one of our posts, and visit the website. We’re not in this to be rich, we’re in it to raise the profile of the sports radio format. With your help we’ll be able to do that! Thanks for your patronage.
Things were generally status quo in the Nielsen Audio reports for Houston radio for the September ratings book.
This monthly rundown on the Nielsen Audio ratings for Houston sports radio covers the period Aug, 12-Sept. 9, including Texans preseason games but no regular-season games.
As always, we start with 6 a.m. to midnight (Monday through Sunday) among men 25-54, which is the key demographic for sports radio. KILT (610 AM) once again led the weeklong numbers over KBME and KFNC (97.5 FM), and KBME and KFNC were again up from a year ago.
Station September August September 2014
KILT (610 AM) 3.4 (14th) 3.0 (T15th) 3.9 (1th)
KBME (790 AM) 2.3 (20th) 2.5 (20th) 2.0 (20th)
KFNC (97.5 FM) 1.5 (23rd) 1.7 (23rd) 1.2 (T24th)
KGOW (1560 AM) 0.1 (T35th) N/A 0.7 (27th)
With the arrival of NFL games and Texans radio programming, KILT has the edge in morning drive (6-10 a.m.) over KBME.
Station September August September 2014
KILT (610 AM) 3.6 (12th) 3.4 (11th) 3.5 (11th)
KBME (790 AM) 2.7 (T16th) 2.1 (17th) 3.8 (9th)
KFNC (97.5 FM) 1.7 (21st) 2.0 (18th) 1.6 (22nd)
KGOW (1560 AM) 0.1 (T35th) N/A 0.8 (27th)
KILT is down from a year ago in middays (10 a.m.-3 p.m.), but so is everybody else.
Station September August September 2014
KILT (610 AM) 4.0 (10th) 4.0 (8th) 4.8 (7th)
KBME (790 AM) 1.7 (T20th) 2.1 (17th) 2.6 (16th)
KFNC (97.5 FM) 1.7 (22nd) 1.6 (22nd) 1.4 (22nd)
KGOW (1560 AM) 0.0 (T39th) N/A 1.2 (23rd)
KILT still leads in afternoon drive time (3-7 p.m.) but was down from a year ago. KFNC continues to show year-to-year growth.
Station September August September 2014
KILT (610 AM) 3.7 (12th) 3.1 (15th) 5.0 (T7th)
KFNC (97.5 FM) 2.5 (22nd) 2.7 (17th) 1.3 (26th)
KBME (790 AM) 1.5 (T23rd) 1.4 (24th) 1.5 (23rd)
KGOW (1560 AM) 0.3 (T31st) N/A 0.8 (27th)
Even though they were already starting to fade in early September, the Astros continued giving KBME a significant boost from 7 p.m. until midnight weekdays.
The numbers are in for Nielsen’s latest sports talk ratings period, known as the “September Book,” even if it covers only Aug. 13 to Sept. 9.
The race in the all-important category of men 25-54 finished:
4.7 for Sportsradio 1310 and 96.7 FM The Ticket
4.5 for 105.3 The Fan
2.0 for KESN-FM (103.3).
On a more intimate level, men 25-54 from Monday to Friday 6 a.m. to 7 p.m. when the big-name, high-priced local talent is on the air, it was: Ticket 5.8; Fan 4.2; KESN 2.2.
When it comes to individual shows, The Ticket’s Morning Musers remain head and shoulders above a crowded pack. Think of them as the legendary Secretariat racing against the rest of the Belmont field. George Dunham, Craig Miller and Gordon Keith scored a 9.4 share among men 25-54. Closest were the station’s Hardline and the Fan’s Ben & Skin, both at 5.0.
Here’s a breakdown by show of the Monday-Friday men 25-54 in September ratings:
The Musers (Ticket), 6-10 a.m. – 9.4
The Hardline (Ticket), 3-7 p.m. – 5.0
Ben & Skin (Fan), 3-7 p.m. – 5.0
BaD Radio (Ticket), noon-3 p.m. – 4.0
G-Bag Nation (Fan), 10 a.m.-3 p.m. – 4.0
Shan & R.J. (Fan), 6-10 a.m. – 3.8
Mike & Mike (KESN), 5-9 a.m. – 3.1
Norm & Donovan (Ticket), 10 a.m.-noon – 3.1
Cowlishaw & Mosley (KESN), 3-6 p.m. – 2.3
Dennis & Friedo (KESN) 11 a.m.-3 p.m. – 1.6
ESPN Network Subs (KESN), 9-11 a.m. – 1.3
To read more of this article visit the Dallas Morning News where it was originally published
One of the real benefits of being removed from the inside of a radio station, is that you can analyze things about the industry without having your judgment skewed as a result of being too close to certain situations.
During the past 10 years, I’ve programmed four radio stations, and during that time I’ve always looked forward to ratings day. Usually once per month on a Monday at 12pm, my station’s would receive their report, and get a better understanding of how the audience was connecting with the product, where the strengths of the brand were, and what challenges needed to be addressed.
For some air talent, this was an important day because a strong performance meant a ratings bonus. For sales people it mattered because a good story could help them in their quest to gain larger investments from clients. And for some like myself, it was an opportunity to learn if the vision and execution for the brand was working.
Having had a chance now to step back, and remove myself from the daily rigors of running a station, I don’t miss that part at all. I thought I would but I don’t.
I know what you’re thinking “you’ve always loved ratings, and you’re not in a building, so that’s why it’s not as big of a deal”. Honestly, my opinion is based on a bigger reason – in its current state, the performance of a personality, brand, and talk show, can’t be measured accurately or receive its fair market value!
I could spend all day railing on the ineffective PPM ratings system, but that’s not my focus. The issue I have is with the mindset of our industry, those who buy and sell advertising, and those who have a chance to influence change but accept the status quo.
One of radio’s biggest problems, is that it’s reactionary. Rather than lead the charge to innovate, and introduce new brands, sounds, and people, the business lives in the past, and present.
How many markets can you think of where a personality who has failed or underperformed in the ratings, gets hired by 3-4 different stations? Rather than take the more difficult road, and introduce something new which will have short-term setbacks, but pay long-term dividends, we default to what we are comfortable with. Someone else’s trash becomes our treasure.
That’s not only an on-air problem, it’s a behind the scenes issue too. Sales people rotate back and forth between various stations in each city, because the talent pool is thin, and scouting, recruiting, and developing people is hard. It doesn’t matter if someone has not made budget multiple times for 2-3 other brands, if they join our team, we’ll get them on track.
That sounds good until the leopard shows their spots and delivers the same exact results as they had before.
I’m not here to single out anyone, but I do want to draw attention to what I believe is the future of impact, and it’s something that should be keeping every single Owner, Corporate Executive, General Manager, Sales Manager, Program Director and Advertising Agency Buyer awake at night.
I’m talking about the power of reach!
There is too much confusion in our business right now about what matters when measuring the performance of a station and/or personality. There’s also a poor understanding of the worth of our products across multiple platforms. More sales people look at the sum total of what they’ve asked a client for, and judge the transaction as a win or loss based on if they get the sale, rather than analyze the entire worth of the package.
Let me give you an example.
If you are in New York, Michael Kay is a pretty big deal. He’s the voice of the New York Yankees, and hosts afternoon drive on 98.7 ESPN New York. His program is simulcast on the YES Network, and can also be heard on SiriusXM, the station’s website and mobile app, as well as through TuneIn and Slacker.
For those who can’t hear it LIVE, audio and video of the program can also be enjoyed via a podcast on the station’s website, Apple iTunes, Player.FM, and on YesNetwork.com. Michael is also on Twitter and has 146,000 followers.
This is what a major brand looks like.
The only question is, does the program receive its full value from advertisers who have their products and messages delivered to listeners on all of these platforms? I want to believe that they do, but I’m not convinced.
Why do I say that? Because in running stations in multiple markets for the past 10 years, sales people are more focused on hitting their number, rather than looking at what the value is of their brand and controllable assets. Advertisers, and ad agencies also have this belief that if they’re going to give you one hundred thousand dollars for three months of advertising, then you better give them as much bang for their buck as possible.
In many cases the sales person will offer “added value” sponsorships before a client even asks for them. Many reps also lack confidence, and a keen understanding of digital and social media advertising, therefore generating large dollars on them becomes nearly impossible.
Now listen, there’s nothing wrong with super serving a client, and hitting the budgeted goal that was set for the sales rep based on traditional radio advertising. But it’s foolish to think we’re going to drastically increase rates and get our worth from advertisers, when our entire history shows we undervalue our brands, and cause our own pricing problems.
This past week in Philadelphia, WIP and 97.5 The Fanatic were engaged in a tight ratings race. WIP won the PPM battle which based on today’s standards means they were the #1 rated brand. However, the Fanatic’s streaming numbers were outstanding, which when combined with the over the air measurement, forced a dead heat between the two stations.
For both brands, they had a story to work with. Based on the existing model our industry works with, WIP is winning. Delivering radio ratings is what the talent are expected to do, and selling those ratings is what their reps are charged with. Except there’s one big problem – if these are the only two areas to concentrate on, how can the industry grow?
Do we really believe that advertisers are only going to care in the future about the way a station performs in PPM? Are sales reps going to only be measured based on how they sell traditional advertising?
We don’t seriously believe that listening through our websites, mobile apps, on-demand, and through other audio providers who we partner with doesn’t count do we? If a PPM meter picks up the audio signal then the listening counts, but if it doesn’t then the listener never really listened to our programming?
I’ve got a better chance of growing a full head of hair than listeners and buyers accepting that nonsense.
This goes back to radio being reactionary, rather than out in front. Who’s fault is it that we have poor measurement? Ours! Who decided to make programming available in all of these other locations yet accepted a system where those listening numbers don’t count towards our proof of performance? We did.
How can we on one hand place our content across multiple platforms, and reward the user, yet on the other hand limit our own ability to demand larger dollars from clients? The system they use to determine whether or not our product performs, doesn’t take into account the total amount of listening in all of these other locations.
You can make a case that the listening being done on all of these other platforms is more reliable than the number you receive in your monthly ratings report. We can tell which days and times a listener clicks on a button and streams the radio station, and which content appeals most to them. Meanwhile, we can’t be sure if we have 100,000 listeners sampling the station on a radio, because that number is determined by 20-30 people carrying a meter.
We also don’t know if those who carry meters have left the device near the radio and walked out of the room, or if they really listen. We have little information about what their content preferences are, and if one meter breaks routine and is unavailable to listen due to a business meeting, vacation, or other distraction, it has a drastic impact on that month’s ratings for the radio station.
How crazy is this, an individual could have their device on, walk into a grocery store which has the radio station playing over the speakers, and if the meter picks up the audio signal for five minutes, that station will get credit for listening. It doesn’t matter that the person with the meter was only exposed to the audio, and not interested in it.
Is this really the best we can do for ourselves, our advertisers and our listeners?
I believe total audience reach and brand association should be priority number one for clients and operators. You can have a great ratings report, and that’ll be part of your story, but as I showcased above with Michael Kay, advertisers are smart enough to recognize when a brand has power to connect their product with a big audience. If you want to reach the largest sum of people, you invest in partnerships with people who have the ability to pull in customers from numerous locations.
If Michael’s TV and radio ratings for the show were low, yet his streaming, podcast, mobile sessions, and audio partnerships were producing giant numbers, then he still has a big audience to offer to an advertiser. Sure it’s better if you have the ratings to go along with it, but listening is more splintered than ever, and the grand total of audience carries much more value than a monthly ratings report.
Think about this, if Michael sent out a tweet to his 146K followers promoting a company, and a bunch of people take his advice and buy the product, don’t you think that satisfies the client? Do they care where the lead came from? No! They simply want more customers, so they can make more money. If they associate with Michael, and their business grows, you better believe they’re going to continue investing in him, and his radio station, even as the rates increase.
If I was spending my money, I’d want to know that my company is reaching the largest audience possible, and providing a return on my investment. I don’t care what report you show me, I want to know that my message has been consumed, and it’s leading to results. However you accomplish it, and on which platform you do it, that’s irrelevant – just help me grow my business!
Voltair has already exposed PPM for having major flaws, and although Nielsen is taking steps to improve their measurement, industry leaders now question whether or not they are reliable. How are you supposed to change a perception when the reality is that the service isn’t 100% accurate? I’m not sure you can.
The most important lesson we’ve learned though, is that it’s the user who has changed the game. People want what they want, when they want it, on the platforms they consume content on, and it’s the company’s issue to figure out how to gain credit for the product consumption, and how to monetize it.
Case in point, look at Katie Nolan of Fox Sports.
In Katie’s case, her reach is way more powerful than her television program. I’ve watched a bunch of her material and I enjoy it immensely, but I have only watched her on television once! I’ve watched her videos on YouTube numerous times, and I’ve clicked links that she’s promoted on Twitter and Facebook. I don’t set an appointment to watch her on television, but I do seek out her content.
Does that mean my viewing doesn’t count or matter? Of course not. It’s Fox Sports’ issue to figure out how to monetize the audience who consume her work in multiple locations, and it’s Katie’s job to simply produce outstanding content that keeps the audiences coming back, and expanding.
If an advertiser is smart, they’ll invest with Katie and Fox, because they recognize they have an ability to reach people. In the end, it’s about brand exposure, influence, and sales. If Katie can put eyeballs and ears on a product, then it shouldn’t matter where it originates from. It’s even more likely to work if that advertiser utilizes her for a personal endorsement. When a talent passionately gets behind a product, the results are often much higher.
There’s another side to this story, and it applies to the advertisers and ad agencies. They need to be part of this solution too. Radio groups have lived and died with Arbitron and Nielsen because it was the system that agencies believed best reflected the interest of the audience in the station’s programming.
Does it have some benefits? Yes. Should it continue to be utilized? Sure. Does counting streaming and mobile help? Yes. But if you’re an advertiser, and you’re utilizing an agency to place your advertising, you should want to see more specifics, results, and total cume across all media platforms, not just a radio and/or television ratings report.
Wouldn’t you want to see what an impact looks like for your brand if you associate your product with a station or personality’s Facebook and Twitter accounts? Wouldn’t you like to know how your brand benefits by being associated with the station’s podcast, and YouTube page?
Maybe your sponsorship includes an association to the brand through TuneIn, Slacker and iTunes. If a show is on radio and television, are you being featured in both locations, and how do you explain it if the advertising is working on the show in one location but not the other?
After all of that has been considered (and there’s many more ways to extend a sponsorship too), then you have to decide, which percentage of your buying should be higher on certain platforms, and lower on others. You also need to decide if you’re willing to invest more in reaching more people. For some clients, that’s not possible.
Is it a lot of extra work with enormous challenges for radio people and buyers? Yes. But we’re not living in a world anymore where television viewing takes place between channels 2 and 13, and radio listening happens only inside of an automobile. We owe it to ourselves, our clients, and our listeners, to do better in showcasing our brand’s true story.
The final piece to this puzzle, comes from the talent side. And this is an area that is going to give some operators and executives indigestion.
Talent today are paid to perform a radio program, which can also be featured on the station’s website, mobile app, and through other audio partnerships. If the program they perform delivers a strong PPM ratings performance, most groups reward them with a quarterly bonus.
Talent are also asked to endorse products in exchange for additional compensation, and most employers require that they contribute to their companies digital efforts either through creating additional written or video content.
But what happens when they start losing out on bonuses because the product is being consumed in other places where it impacts their credit?
What if a program delivers massive streaming numbers or podcasting numbers, but it’s not showing up on the ratings report? Shouldn’t the talent be incentivized for that? If they get behind the strategy, promote it effectively, and the station delivers record numbers on these platforms, which leads to increased interest and business from clients, shouldn’t the talent share in the success? Will bonuses change in the future and include performance incentives across all audio platforms?
I hear radio companies today talk a lot about the importance of being stronger in the digital space, and users have already demonstrated that they will reward those efforts if the content available is good, and presented by personalities they enjoy reading or listening to. However, what I don’t see being discussed is how the talent shares in this space.
If you’re a personality, and you’re hired to host a radio program, deliver ratings, and help advertisers sell their products, and you check all of those boxes, you’ve done your job. However, if you’re willing to add on writing and creating video for the brand’s digital platforms, that’s even better. It shows you’re willing to do whatever it takes to connect with your audience, and support your employer.
But when that added work starts to register, and becomes profitable to the place of business, employers shouldn’t be surprised when a talent is back inside the office with their hands out asking for more. If you want to grow your digital performance you need great performers, and the talent will do the work, but eventually it will cost something.
In your place of business, do you have a bonus system in place for a talent if they deliver a certain number of podcast downloads? Do you have a rate card established for talent who endorse a client’s products on their Twitter account? Is there an incentive strategy for them if they produce written or video content and deliver an agreed upon number of clicks?
I’m not talking about “added value”, “we’ll get you some trade” or “we’ll throw a few bucks your way”. If we can create a radio ratings bonus structure to keep talent pushing to perform, then there should be other systems in place to reward them for taking on additional projects to help the company grow its digital footprint.
The mentality too often in our industry is to demand our people to do more, and fail to reward them for it. When we do that it usually results in them doing what was requested, but not emotionally getting behind it. It’s equivalent to reading a LIVE mention, and delivering a personal endorsement. One pays you, one doesn’t. Coincidentally the talent invest themselves in the LIVE spot, and breeze past the mentions.
This may require bigger conversations with multiple leaders, and different companies, but as the media landscape continues to evolve, this will become a bigger focus, and if we don’t start thinking about it and planning for it now, it could become a bigger problem.
The last thing I’ll leave you with is this. Today, we place the content of our shows into multiple locations, which leads to splintered listening, yet we fail to build a complete strategy to capitalize on all of it. You can offer great content in ten different places, but the user is still only going to consume it in one. If you’re going to do that, and potentially impact your own performance on a platform which may be more important, shouldn’t you be sure that it makes financial sense to do so?
There’s a world out there that craves our content, but likes to choose when and where they get it. It’s our job to figure out how to capitalize on that interest, and promote our effectiveness across ALL channels, not just one measurement system.
To succeed there needs to be additional training, new ideas, and new people. You can’t expect everyone to grasp every new concept, and what they’re preparing for today, may not even be what’s important to your business’ bottom line in 2-3 years.
There is though one thing I firmly believe. If you want to command larger dollars in the present and future, you better have reach on your side. Total audience has more staying power, and long-term revenue potential than any other measurement.
My advice, be everywhere you can, and have a game plan for how you’ll present your data to those who are considering doing business with you. No client is going to reject doing business with you if you have a large audience to offer. Even if it’s built through multiple platforms. You can stick with what you know, and do what radio is notorious for doing, which is waiting for it to become a bigger deal. The only question I have is, can you really afford it?
One of the best things to happen to me during my career was something that I initially rejected, and felt was a major step backwards.
In 2002, I was hosting afternoons and programming 1340/1390 ESPN Radio in Poughkeepsie, NY. I spent a few years prior working for a smaller local station (WTBQ), so this was my first entry into working for a corporate group, and having an opportunity to test myself on a bigger station with a bigger audience against larger expectations.
Everything was going great, and I felt I was making inroads in my career, when all of a sudden, the bottom fell out.
I was called into the upstairs office, and informed by my GM (Chuck Benfer) that our new owners had made a decision to flip my sports station to Spanish. Chuck and I had a great relationship and he wanted to keep me around, so he asked if I would consider moving over to the rock station 101.5 WPDH, where I’d serve as Producer of the Morning Show “Wakin Up with Coop and Mikey“. I’d also host a weekly wrestling show on Sunday evenings, which allowed me to maintain my on-air chops.
In that moment, I had to choose between staying in the business, and doing something outside of my comfort zone, or declining the opportunity, and pursuing other jobs in sports radio while being unemployed. Having a family to feed, I chose the paycheck, and to this day, I am extremely glad I did.
At the time, this was foreign territory for me, and while I loved Howard Stern, I wasn’t a big fan of morning shows on music stations. A lot of the entertainment felt forced and hokey to me, and I worried that I’d be involved in a similar situation. Waking up at 3am also didn’t have a lot of appeal, but getting a 2 second cameo on the first season of “American Chopper” made up for it (sort of).
I often reflect on the 2 years I spent working outside of sports radio as a huge positive, because it taught me a lot about being able to entertain an audience in a short period of time. It also pushed me creatively to think about things differently, and take chances with content that I might not have otherwise considered.
When you’re hosting a sports talk show, you do a lot of reading, and you beat to death the two or three local stories with a few opinions, phone calls, and interviews. Rarely do you look at each minute of your show as being critically important. The mindset usually is “we have 3-4 hours to cover, so there’s plenty of time to do things, and the audience will accept it”.
When you work on a morning show that plays music, and allows for short talk segments, your content selection and execution has to be crisp, and if you miss on an opportunity, it could be another 30-45 minutes before you get a chance to redeem yourself. That is a personal hell for any on-air entertainer.
My time with WPDH lasted a little over a year, and I moved from there to another rock radio station (PYX 106 in Albany, NY) where I spent 6 months producing the “Wakin Up With The Wolf” show with Bob Wohlfeld, Ellen Z, Ethan Youker and my personal favorite, John Tobin.
John built a strong brand at WPDH prior to moving to PYX 106, and although we knew each other, and shared mutual friends, we had never directly worked together. He delivered big ratings on the shows he was part of, and I was a big fan of his work, so I knew it’d be fun collaborating, and learning from him.
I quickly learned that despite being a phenomenal morning talent, John hated waking up and doing mornings. However, once the light went on, he was ready to perform. His natural talents and energy took over, and his ability to be spontaneous, and keep his partners on the edge of their seats, fueled the show to have incredible success.
That talent led to him having multiple successes in Albany. He made a huge impact on the morning show on PYX 106 , and then switched gears and hosted an afternoon sports talk show on the Fox Sports Radio affiliate with Freddie Coleman. Freddie as you know has since gone on to a very successful career at ESPN Radio.
What I learned during the time I worked with John was that there is a method to the madness when it comes to creating bits, characters, impersonations, and parodies. John is creatively brilliant, and enjoys performing, but he’s also a harsh critic. He’s not afraid to throw an idea away, even if it might be suitable to the rest of the room. If it’s not great, doesn’t leave the audience craving more, and doesn’t leave the cast on the show in stitches, he’ll revisit the idea later, or throw it out and work on something else.
As someone who listens to, and appreciates great comedy in radio, I believe bits, characters, impersonations, stunts and parodies can greatly enhance and compliment a show. Look around the country today and you’ll find a number of people doing this well. Lance Zierlein in Houston, Joe Conklin on WIP, Mike Bell in Atlanta, Whitey Gleason in Sacramento, Jay Mohr at Fox Sports, and Gregg Giannotti at the CBS Sports Radio Network all come to mind. Another guy who’s still developing but also has a knack for this is Clayton Miller.
Turn on your television and you’ll also find shows like Family Guy, The Simpsons, South Park, and the Impractical Jokers who employ this same approach, and make a LOT of money, and generate large audiences. I watched the same strategy work firsthand for one of my best friends’ brothers, Johnny Brennan, who created the Jerky Boys, and built his brand into a mainstream success.
Bear in mind, all of these elements have to be executed well in order to be effective, and the talent has to have great ability to pull them off. When done right, they create a surprise in the programming, and keep an audience craving more, and sharing their listening experience with anyone around them who will listen. When done poorly, it can add a speed bump the size of a mountain into your show.
I thought it’d be fascinating to get inside the brain of someone who does this well, and knows what to look for and avoid when introducing new elements into a show. John was gracious enough to take some time and share his own personal account for what goes into the creative process, and if you’re curious to learn what works, what doesn’t, and the challenge with executing each strategy, I think you’ll enjoy this.
On an unrelated note, if you work on a show and John is ever coming through your city doing stand-up, or you’re just looking for someone to add some entertainment value to your show, get in touch with him. He’s very entertaining and skilled in creating memorable radio moments.
Here’s a quick sample from one of his standup performances. Be advised, there’s some colorful language in it.
Creating Bits, Characters and Impersonations by John Tobin
When it comes to radio bits, here are some simple do’s and don’ts.
DO: Be Funny!
DON’T: Be Unfunny!
Sounds obvious, right? However, executing this requires a sense of what the audience will react to with laughter. A sharp sense. I recognize that this is the equivalent of telling a would-be musician, “be musical“, but that’s the reality of it.
Let’s talk about a few different types of bits.
FLY on the WALL: “Gee, I wonder how the conversation went when Goodell sat down with Brady and his reps.”
This will take some imagination and probably 2-3 voices. Basically, it’s sketch comedy. Let it build. These are fun to create and will allow you to depart from the typical, “Host A and Host B discuss an issue.” Work it out. Record it. Roll it out on the air.
Song Parodies and Produced Pieces:
A song parody is a great vehicle for humor. If you don’t believe me, look at the size of Weird Al’s pool. Try to jam your parody with jokes. Write the jokes first. Keep them on the side. Then make them rhyme. Try them out on people. The stronger ones go deeper into the tune.
The punchline of a parody is typically a pun on the title of the original song. If the pun is the only laugh, keep the parody short. Give the context with the verse, drop the punchline on them and scram.
EMPHASIS: If there’s only one joke don’t try to extend the bit.
There’s nothing worse than a parody with a throwaway (non-humorous) verse that goes beyond the punchline. All you’re doing at that point is offering another throwaway verse and making the audience wait for the same punchline, which is no longer a punchline since they’ve already heard it.
If you’re loading it up with funny lines, by all means go 2 verses (and if it’s hilarious, go for three, as long as the third verse has some kind of twist). Recognize when you have a one-joke bit, and resist beating a dead horse.
I used to argue with a partner about a particular bit by a band that called itself, “Hayseed Dixie“, who covered AC/DC songs in bluegrass style. “She was a fast machine / she kept her motor clean“, check please. I get it, “You Shook Me (all night long)” over banjos and washboards.
I get it. No, really, I get it. TURN IT OFF.
It’s funny…. for about 15 seconds….then it gets tedious because the joke is over. We used to argue every time because he insisted on playing the full 2 minutes. But the joke is OVER! This is where your sense of “audience” has to come to the rescue.
As far as a tempo, bear in mind that you want them to hear every syllable, so, not too fast. Too slow is bad too, because you don’t want the audience to have SO much time that they can figure out where you’re going. Pace is important.
John Tobin’s “Sofa King” Commercial
LIVE Character Bits:
These have always been a favorite of mine. If you can break into (and think as) a character it adds such a dimension to the show. If you do it spontaneously, even better. Surprise everyone in the room. Of course, you need to have that sort of leeway, but if you do, it’s always a turning point in the mood and feel of the show. Such a great pivot.
If spontaneity isn’t something you can get away with in your particular situation, you can open a break by having the character introduced, “Joining us in the studio“.
One way we’d shoehorn a character into the program was via a corny “knock on the door” which was literally knuckles on the console. “Oh, hey, look who’s here!”, and off you go.
I always found that characters who had an attitude worked best. Don’t be afraid to be a little aggressive and OWN the room. One character bit you can go to pretty easily is “the fan of your rival“. Think Red Sox fan. Think Yankee fan. Think Auburn/Alabama.
Use the accents, use the attitude, create a caricature. It’s a great device, and easy to score with since the resonance is built-in.
John Tobin’s character “Esteban” delivers bad pickup lines
Phone-ins and Impersonations:
These are also fun and can be very short & sweet. One great use of an in-studio phone is the “second-life“. If, in the middle of a busy break, you think of something funny to say but you can’t fit it into the show in that moment, do not despair. Sure, the moment may have passed for you to use the line as YOU, but if there’s a phone in the studio, you’re golden.
I’ll grab the console phone and lean out of sight. My partner will see me wiggle four fingers (meaning Line 4, our Hotline) and give the call letters as he picks up. I’ll then do a 2-second re-set, “A minute ago you were saying“___<reset>___” and I was thinking, “____<joke>_____”.
The phone-in can also be used in the exact same way as the LIVE character.
I started in radio as a freelance contributor to a morning show (i95 in CT). I used to write scripts at home and fax (yes, fax…Pony Express had shut down by then) the in-studio guys their parts. Their scripts would have only a slight hint of my line, because I didn’t want to tip the punchline. They’d take my call LIVE and we’d roll with it. For this, I received the grand sum of $12.50.
Impersonations:
As far as impressions go, it’s something you’re either born with, or not. Just like musicality. However, sometimes you can fake it.
The Rik Smits voice, for example, is completely something I ascribed to him. I have no idea how Rik sounds so I just created a character and made him into Arnold Schwarzenegger as a nasty pro wrestler. I was so committed to its delivery and its attitude that I established it as his voice. From what I understand, Rik is actually fairly soft spoken.
That’s one way out of doing an inaccurate impression. You decide what the impression is going to be and commit to it 500%. To make it work, try to find the salient characteristics of it and caricature them. That’s another way to bail out of not being able to nail an impression 100%.
John Tobin’s “I Am Enormous” as sung by the Rik Smits character
For Chris “Mad Dog” Russo, the impression I performed was significant because he was local and he was popular. He also has a loud, over the top persona which was easy to parody. What you try to look for are things that other people might overlook.
For instance, “Mad Dog” does this “gasping-for-air inhale” after he laughs. I always exaggerated it and dragged it out to about two and a half seconds.
He also has a problem pronouncing the R and L. I did a bit once where he discussed nothing but the Royals, Orioles, and Oilers. All of which he pronounced identically ERLLOLRRLLERL.
WHO?
The ERLLOLRRLLERL.
WHO?
Kansas City!
I would get the character speaking so fast that everything became unintelligible except for every 19th word. Gibberish–gibberish-gibberish Yankee Stadium. Gibberish-gibberish-gibberish $10 beer. Of course, you want to latch onto a couple of catchphrases that the individual uses. In Chris’ case, “give me a break, for Pete’s sake and for crying out loud”, were all part of his repertoire.
John Tobin’s “Chris “Mad Dog” Russo” Impersonation
One bit I created and wrote was Phil Rizzuto’s Mini-Golf. The Scooter would call-in to announce his Grand Opening and every hole had a theme. Each theme centered around its own current sports story.
There was a Lawrence Taylor-themed hole. A Pete Rose-themed hole. Today, you could go with a Patriots/Brady-themed hole or maybe one for Rex Ryan. One theme/one joke. However many solid jokes you can come up with, that’s how many you talk about. Then, you’re done.
Another character I used to do was Dunkin Downe, a 6’9 goggle-wearing power forward with a sense of humor. One time Dunkin called in and did an entire bit on the size of the Piston’s Vinnie Johnson’s head. “Vinnie Johnson was standing on a corner in his blue Pistons warmup….a woman pulled down his bottom lip trying to mail a letter, man.”
In my opinion, voices kill. They add such a dimension to a program and can differentiate you from your competition. If you have that kind of talent under your roof exploit it until you bleed.
CBS Radio’s 98.5 The Sports Hub was the runaway winner in the summer Nielsen Audio Ratings period, finishing first overall in the Boston market with an 11.3 share in the men 25-54 demographic.
That easily outdistanced the runner-up, classic hits station WROR, which earned a 6.9 in the three-month summer period from June 18-Sept. 9.
WEEI (93.7), the market’s other highly rated sports station, tied for fourth with fellow Entercom station WAAF with a 6.2 share. WZLX, a CBS Radio property, was third (6.3).
The Sports Hub has been the highest-rated station in Boston for 11 of the last 12 three-month ratings periods. The only time it hasn’t held the top spot was summer of 2014, when it was third (6.2) and WEEI was fifth (5.4). WZLX was first that summer at 8.4.
In the specific day segments, The Sports Hub’s “Toucher and Rich” program finished first in morning drive (6-10 a.m.) with a 14.7 share. WEEI’s “Dennis and Callahan” program, which also features Kirk Minihane, was third (8.1). Last summer, D&C edged T&R, 8.3-8.2.
In midday (10 a.m.-2 p.m.), the Sports Hub’s “Zolak and Bertrand” program was first with an 11.2 share, while WEEI’s “Middays With MFB,” featuring Lou Merloni, Christian Fauria, and Tim Benz (who left for a job in Pittsburgh and was replaced this month by Glenn Ordway), was tied for seventh with country station WKLB (4.2).
In midday (10 a.m.-2 p.m.), the Sports Hub’s “Zolak and Bertrand” program was first with an 11.2 share, while WEEI’s “Middays With MFB,” featuring Lou Merloni, Christian Fauria, and Tim Benz (who left for a job in Pittsburgh and was replaced this month by Glenn Ordway), was tied for seventh with country station WKLB (4.2).
In afternoon drive (2-6 p.m.), the Sports Hub’s “Felger and Massarotti” show was first for the 12th straight ratings period — a three-year span — with an 14.4 share. WEEI’s “Dale and Holley” program, which also includes Jerry Thornton, was fourth (6.0).
For the evening numbers, visit the Boston Globe who originally published this article
Early in my career, I was working for a radio station in Poughkeepsie, NY. The morning show I was producing and providing news reports for wasn’t producing the numbers that upper management were looking for. After making numerous changes to try and elevate the ratings, our General Manager felt a change was necessary, so he cut ties with my crew, and hired a new morning show.
I remember driving to Bristol prior to my first day of work, and having some time to reflect on everything I had endured during the early part of my career. One of the most memorable and important parts of that journey was being fired. Had I not gone through that difficult period, I’d not have landed in the best situation of my career. Instead I would have remained where I was, doing good work, but not relentlessly pursuing my dreams, and making bigger contributions.
When a boss is charged with being the bearer of bad news, they’re often given instruction of how the company wants something handled. While it’s certainly smart to abide by your employer’s wishes, there are times where you have to step back, and say “screw it, this doesn’t feel right” and get the message across in your own way.
If there’s one thing I know for sure, and this has been echoed by numerous people inside the media industry, there is life after ESPN.
What you can decide though is how you will learn from the experience, and rebound from it. 10 months ago I chose to leave a great position in San Francisco with no assurances that I’d land on my feet. By taking that risk, I now have my son living with me, my family close by, and I’ve started my own company and am enjoying every minute of running it.
