A few days after a podcast clip of Bill Simmons criticizing Pablo Torre for his recent reporting on University of North Carolina head coach Bill Belichick and his relationship with Jordon Hudson surfaced on the internet, the two sports media personalities hashed out their apparent media beef. Torre, who was in Los Angeles, Calif. for the Peabody Awards, appeared on site at The Ringer podcast studios with Simmons, to whom he explained the logic behind investing time and resources into his investigative reporting surrounding the story. In addition, he acknowledged that he has devoted “a disturbing percentage” of his life to the narrative and acceded that Hudson was correct in informing him that he needed to find a new hobby.
Torre explained that the episodes of his podcast, Pablo Torre Finds Out, are done in a documentary-style manner where he essentially unboxes his journalism to friends, who react in real time to the findings. Katie Nolan and Michael Cruz Kayne appeared on the show and listened as Torre divulged he spoke with 11 sources who dealt with Hudson directly and discussed a variety of matters pertaining to her involvement in Belichick’s life. In his discussion with Simmons, he argued that the story was newsworthy since he is a public figure and has acted contrary to his overall character.
“I’m like, ‘Bill, you more than anyone else know why Bill Belichick is fascinating and why the archetype of him, who was the paragon of discipline, privacy, ‘Do your job,’ defensive strategy, public relations mastery,’” Torre outlined. “The guy had in his office at Gillette [Stadium], Sun Tzu ‘The Art of War,’ ‘The battle is won or lost before it even begins,’ and so just him as this unique archetype in American life, not just sports, but American life, that you personally, of course, have a deep understanding of. I’m told he’s the greatest coach of all time.”
Simmons referenced his podcast, The Rewatchables, in which he discusses compelling movies and talked about how he “used to obsess over a bunch of dumb sh*t and try to answer questions like this.” Torre challenged this assertion, however, contending that they both still do the same thing, which led Simmons to aver that it was the media tour that perturbed him more in this instance.
“It seemed like you were so serious about it,” Simmons said. “I was like, ‘Why is he treating this like Watergate? Ultimately, who f*****g cares that this guy is dating somebody who’s 50 years younger than him who wants to be on his work emails?’ Is this actually an important story or is this just a fun story to get clicks?”
Torre recognized that Simmons is not alone in that and it is a perception that has been cultivated through aggregation. On top of that, he talked about how Belichick is the highest-paid employee in the entire state of North Carolina and effectively using Hudson as a means to assimilate into public life. With all of the twists and turns of the narrative, Torre recognizes this as a story that touches on media, business, college sports, public money and the National Football League.
Later in the discussion, he referenced his reporting on whether or not Los Angeles Lakers forward LeBron James’ attended the funeral of Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame guard Kobe Bryant. The reason he explored the story, which took place as James confronted ESPN commentator Stephen A. Smith courtside at a Lakers game, was that it was being argued in public but not being reported. Torre also divulged that he explains the context and reasoning to assist people skeptical surrounding his ethics or motives in understanding his rationale.
“The ethics are one thing because you’re doing real reporting,” Simmons said. “The motives are where you open yourself up a little bit because from afar, somebody could look at it and go, ‘You’re just doing this because you want clicks,’ right, and I’m sure you’ve heard that.”
Torre feels that anyone who has ever created something online has heard these contentions, and he also believes in the episodes that they publish. Furthermore, he talked about a story surrounding why some inmates on death row shout their favorite sports teams as their last words that led to the podcast visiting a facility where he articulated that a man was unjustly sentenced due to police hypnosis. The podcast episode was nominated for a Peabody Award in the radio/podcast category by unanimous vote and featured reporting from correspondent David Fleming, and Simmons conjectured that the stories involving Belichick and James could be serving as bridges to compel people to keep listening to more content.
“I think the question of like, ‘What is journalism today?,’ to me, the fundamental question,” Torre said. “The difference and key distinction between gossip and journalism is that we are definitively saying, ‘We have reported this, and we believe based on all of these sources and facts and bits of research that it’s true.’ It’s not, ‘Ah, I heard this thing — might be true, might not be.’ No, we are rigorously investigating something in order to say, ‘We are here to publish this as true.’”
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