Thank you for checking out The Industry According To. Every Tuesday we speak with a different expert or leader from somewhere in the vast music industry — label executives, artist managers, programmers, talent, artists, consultants, and beyond. To be considered as a future guest, email me at keithblackboxgroup@gmail.com.
Today we sit down with one of the sharpest research minds you’ll come across, Leigh Jacobs. He is the President, Media Research & Marketing at NuVoodoo Media Services. Leigh has been at the forefront of ground-breaking studies, has deep expertise in micro-targeting and ratings-prospect modeling, and frequently writes about listener motivations. Prior to NuVoodoo, he held senior roles at Critical Mass Media, Tribune, and was a multi-format radio programmer earlier in his career.
So, let’s dive in.
*Editor’s Note: Answers have been edited for clarity and length.*
Keith: NuVoodoo research shows mood enhancement, companionship, and local connection rank just behind “free” as the top reason people listen, with things like contesting and promotion further down the list. This shows a hierarchy gap between what stations think matters and what listeners say they value. What are the ramifications when those priorities don’t line up?
Leigh: The 2020 film, The Social Dilemma, reminded us, “If you’re not paying for the product, you are the product.” Radio remains free, but with heavier commercial loads than we used to impose on listeners and, in many markets, fewer programming choices. That’s worrisome for me.
“Free” is near the top whenever researchers ask listeners why they listen — in the same way that most of us would say safety or reliability is a key reason we have the car/truck/SUV we drive — yet most of us really chose that vehicle because of how it made us feel. “Free” might be why someone doesn’t pay to listen to Spotify in the car, but it’s rarely what drives decisions between stations. Not many stations lean on “free” in their on-air positioning — and that’s fine.
The expectation that the music on your station is going to support a listener’s need to stay energized, relax, etc. often comes into play. The entertainment, information, or camaraderie provided by a host can drive listening decisions for some. And the unique connection to a local community can play a role. It’s important to have a keen grasp on why listeners are coming to your station and supporting those concepts in your branding.
I’m a huge fan of staying in contact with listeners via social media, email, phone, and especially in person. There are always insights to be gleaned from having listeners talk about the experience of listening to your station — and the radio in general.
Mood and the Music
Keith: While data is showing “mood enhancement” as a key reason for listening, there historically hasn’t been any “mood” data points in traditional music research done by radio. If mood is not a top driver, should radio be adding “mood” identifiers into music research the same way it uses “fit?”
Leigh: The oft-used AC liner “music that makes you feel good” would work across lots of formats — though that verbiage might sound odd on a station playing Hip Hop or Alternative.
Even more important is on-air talent supporting how great the music is. I hear too many stations where hosts rush past the music to get to a promo or other content. I know it’s hard to stay enthused playing the same songs shift after shift, but those songs are beloved by wide swaths of listeners — and ignoring the opportunity to bond over their enthusiasm is a missed opportunity.
I’m not a fan of “fit” testing. At NuVoodoo, we keep respondents focused on how they feel about each song — reacting, not analyzing. When you’re listening in the car, you don’t think about how you feel, you just react — turning up the volume or changing the station. It’s not an analysis, it’s a reaction.
We do have clients that find value in “fit” testing some songs. For those clients, respondents listen to hooks a second time after the primary interview to get their “fit” opinions.
The Ratings Game
Keith: You’ve spent years studying ratings-prospect behavior (meaning people who are actually willing to wear a meter or fill out a diary) — what is more important for ratings today, having the perfect music mix or the best on-air talent in the market?
Leigh: My immediate answer is “yes!” Ideally, you’d like a well-conceived music mix AND great on-air talent. Having one doesn’t relieve you of needing to work on the other.
I live in Philly. Can you imagine WMMR resting on the laurels of Preston & Steve and not fretting about playing “everything that rocks?” That’s not how they operate. Conversely, even if your talent isn’t a major listener draw, you should still strive to make them the very best they can be in their dayparts.
Cume vs. Core
Keith: An 80/20 balance of AQH/P1 once meant health at radio (80% of listening came from the most loyal 20% of cume). Today it’s more common to see 60/40 or 65/35 because PPM pointed brands to increase cume before satisfying the ultra-core. So at Leigh-FM, what’s more important in 2026, Cume or Core?
Leigh: Cume. People have so many new listening options competing for their time. Stations MUST work to build cume all the time. Deciding to continue by super-serving the existing core accepts that your audience will decline every year. Core listeners find new technologies and listen less to radio. Core listeners defect to different stations — often for reasons having nothing to do with your programming. They get a new job and hear something different at the new workplace. They break up with a spouse and adopt a different station to present as their new image for dating.
I’ve had longtime marketing clients tell me their in-house digital group can handle their marketing budgets for less than we charge. When I check in after a disappointing ratings result I hear that the in-house group didn’t employ the right targeting or prioritized the in-house work far lower than paid work for station advertising clients.
We’re rabid about maintaining our edge in marketing; remaining effective with smaller budgets, being maniacs about details, ensuring we deliver the contracted impressions with the right creative and the right consumers to get the right result.
While NuVoodoo loves helping stations with their marketing, it’s most important to us as fans of radio that marketing for stations gets done. With so much media clamoring for consumers’ attention, radio must stay in the fray and tell its story.
What’s Trending
Keith: NuVoodoo is known for spotting trends early. For example: your studies were early in determining many listeners believe some radio contests are fake. Is there a new trend your data is showing that stations should be considering as they begin to prepare for 2027?
Leigh: Listener satisfaction is taking a beating in plenty of markets. Where there used to be three or more stations competing in a single format, there may be only one. Listeners have always played the presets in their cars, punching around to find a better song or a station not playing commercials, etc. With FM stations switching from mainstream music formats to spoken word, religion, Spanish-language, etc. listener appetites for variety are falling to a smaller array of stations in 2026 — which is frustrating to many listeners.
In too many cases, there are lots of listening options on HD subchannels — stations that many listeners know NOTHING ABOUT. We can target those people with digital advertising. It’d be great for an owner to take on the challenge of awakening listeners to the additional programming options already at their fingertips.
Listening in the car this week I was thinking that lots of imaging and production I was hearing was pretty similar to what the business was running 10 or 20 years ago. Intros for TV shows look different today than they did before. Compare how a McDonald’s location looks today compared to how one looked 10 years ago. Fast food outlets in general are different now — different food, different vibe, different look.
Winning Gen Z
Keith: Reaching Gen Z is the most common challenge discussed, but rarely is there a strategy built around attracting Gen Z. Is Gen Z even a realistic target for radio? And if so, what would Leigh-FM do to attract them?
Leigh: You’re talking about people born from 1997 to 2012. They’re turning 29 this year. They’re very different from the Millennials that precede them. Having grown up with Web 2.0, they have a different relationship with music compared to any older generation. If they’re listening to radio, it’s probably in a car and probably because it’s inconvenient to listen to anything else. If you want them to listen to your station, start by listening to them seriously. Don’t treat them as a shoulder of the bell curve that you’ll just “get” by appealing to their older siblings.
The New ABNormal
Keith: Hard to believe, but COVID was six years ago — and since Day 1 you were entrenched and studying changes in habits, and you’ve talked about “the new ABNormal.” Explain “the new ABNormal” — and what’s the one post-pandemic behavior shift the industry still hasn’t fully addressed or adapted to?
Leigh: “The new ABNormal” was all about the shifts in lockdown and the changes in lives and habits that followed. While most businesses are back to having people on site, some have flexibility for some work from home (WFH) time. Are your regular listeners still checking in with your station on WFH days? In our qualitative work we’ve spoken with so many listeners in recent years who say they don’t listen to radio on days where they don’t commute. Many of those folks tell us they’d listen more at home if there was an app that allowed them to listen on their phone. Of course, almost every station is available on an app — often a station-branded app. It’s a matter of communicating that information to listeners, laying out the benefits of the app in an entertaining and memorable way (over and over).
The Research Trap
Keith: There’s no shortage of data available, from mScore to charts, Shazam to streams and beyond — this leads many programmers to believe traditional radio style OMT/AMT testing is no longer needed. What’s the flaw in that thinking?
Leigh: Many of those are great indicators of interest in emerging songs and artists, though they’re national or regional in scope — and most stations serve a local audience. National research often shows breakouts for regions, purporting that results for the “Northeast” are equally applicable for New York City, Portland, ME, and Lancaster, PA.
mScore can guide choices for the ratings panel that exists today, though following the tastes of the existing meter panel too closely can leave a station vulnerable as meters turn over. I recall a Classic Hits client where a panelist apparently disliked “In the Air Tonight” — while the song ranked top five in their OMT two years running. The client enjoyed great ratings anyway and was well positioned when that panelist fell out.
Stations that implement the music research we sell see their ratings improve. It’s a sample of random respondents screened exactly as you want them: in your market, in your demos, with the listening characteristics you specified. Our respondents are online and paid for participating, just like Nielsen respondents. No sweating whether everyone shows up at a hotel for an old-style AMT — respondents complete the interview where and when it’s convenient for them. We over-recruit our tests by as much as 20% to ensure the sample the client sees is perfect. I look at every piece of research we send out, bringing a PD’s eye to make sure it’ll make sense to the end user.
The One Data Point
Keith: When you conduct perceptual research, the findings will include hundreds of different data points from top-of-mind awareness to music or brand ownership images — what’s the single most important data point people should be watching in 2026?
Leigh: Watch AQH persons — not AQH shares — across demos in your market. Which demos can help you build and maintain audience for your sales team to monetize? Keep an eye on PUMM (or PUR) in your market.
The One Finding
Keith: Very few have seen more research than you over the years — what’s one research finding that genuinely surprised you and changed the way you think about listeners?
Leigh: Many people who listen aren’t coming to the radio to listen to one specific station. They’re using the radio as an appliance — and it’s an appliance that doesn’t work as well for many today as it did in the past. They don’t know the names of any on-air talent. They’re hazy about the station names and positioning statements. For many of them, most positioning statements and sweepers and promos run together. Daring to zero-base the sound of a station — making it sound truly different than the competing stations — would take guts. The business needs more of that.
The Blank Slate
Keith: Last question — blank slate — say anything you want to any sector of the radio, research or music industry. What do you want them to hear?
Leigh: We in radio need to do everything — and I mean EVERYTHING we can to serve sellers. The legend goes that in the heyday of disco, with the sales manager at WKTU saying they had no available drivetime inventory, a nightclub owner pulled a gun insisting that his new club needed to be on the air tomorrow.
Often, the people who are the best equipped to generate ideas on how to engage listeners to check out an advertiser are the folks in programming. Need great copywriting? Ask the person who spent time figuring out how to not sound rushed while promoting a contest or station appearance over a 14-second song intro. The days of pitting sellers against programming are over — today we need everyone putting their weight behind generating revenue.
I’m passionate about the brand lift studies that NuVoodoo is doing to support radio sales. We’ve helped clients extend contracts and secure bigger buys because we’re experts at sampling radio listeners.
Barrett Media produces daily content on the music, news, and sports media industries. Sign up for our newsletters to stay updated and get the latest information right in your inbox.
